Batman Vs Superman: Dawn of Justice

Don’t understand the negative critics of this movie. Personally I enjoyed it. People slammed he casting choice for Ben Affleck just seconds after he was chosen to the point of where there was one or more online petitions to get him removed and replaced. He ended up having a great performance in his portrayal and I don’t believe I’d have enjoyed this movie as much as I did had anyone else besides maybe Michael Keaton (probably too old for the role now though) played Batman. Christian Bale tried his best and while I appreciate his effort, he didn’t get Batman’s voice down right and he even stated such himself in a recent interview. Affleck, while not as good as Keaton, was better than Bale, Kilmer and Clooney put together.

The movie had a great Batman and Superman meeting, confrontation and fight as the movie was named Batman Vs Superman. The last Vs movie I saw, Freddy Vs Jason was misnamed as they barely fought each other. Thought movie handled WW well. For who complain that there was more Diana than WW as in most of her appearances were not in her battle armor, understand that this movie only served to introduce her, basically it was WW 101, and set her up for her own solo film. Considering Dawn of Justice was also part of this movies name, this was the start to the eventual Justice League movies. many believe Man of Steel was the start. I don’t agree. I think MOS set up Dawn of Justice, which to me set up Justice League.
Jesse Eisenberg was a better Lex Luthor than I thought he’d be. The only movie of his I saw was Social Network so it was hard for me to take him seriously as Lex, but he did a great job. Wasn’t crazy about the guy who payed Alfred though. But he didn’t have too many scenes so it’s no big deal. Wasn’t crazy about Doomsday or whoever that creature was either.

The music was great! Been listening to the OST even before I saw the movie and kept on doing so since I finished watching it. Zimmer recently stated he was retiring from scoring superhero films. I don’t know if he’s contractually obligated to continue through till after Justice League. But if this really it for him, man this OST was a helluva way to go out!

For those who liked it, any favorite scenes? Mine were:
1. The opening flashback of Wayne’s parents being murdered. The accompanying music made it all the more better.
2. Batman’s 1st appearance. It’s the scene where one cop shot his partner by accident and stated "I saw him! I didn’t think he was real!"
3. The Batmobile scene. The end of this scene saw Superman confront Batman. Batman asked "Do you bleed?" followed by "You will."
4. The Batman desert scene, revealed I believe to be a dream Wayne was having.
5. Batman Vs Superman.
6. Batman saving Kent’s mother, Martha.
7. Batman Superman, WW Vs who I believed to be Doomsday, but not sure if that’s who the creature was.
8. Batman confronting Lex in jail.

The only thing(s) in the movie I don’t quite get and maybe some non-criticizing person who saw the movie could enlighten me on:
1. Why they had the funeral for Superman? I get that he was struck in the heart by the creature after he stuck the Kryptonite staff into him. But Superman’s Superman if you get what I mean. They teased him being alive at the very end when I saw the coffin lift a tiny bit, taking the dirt off the top if it.
2. There was a scene, I believe before Bruce attended Lex’s invitation party or whatever it was, where he was in the Bat Cave and he opened up the closet, just stared at the Batsuit, then closed the closet. I didn’t get what the point of that was. It’s one thing to open the closet and take the suit out. But to open it, stare, then close…..I guess he did it for some type of inspiration?

For the Justice League, I hope to get some type of villain team-up. Batman, Superman, WW are gonna be in JL. Aquaman, Flash, probably Cyborg too. That’s 6 so far. Not sure if they’ll have anymore. My only exposure to JL was the cartoon that had 7 members (Batman was a part-timer.) Not really familiar with WW or Aquaman’s rogue gallery. Some of the Flash’s big villains are Captain Cold, Weather Wizard, Zoom, Killer Frost (the last two, I;m going by the current Tv show which is unrelated to the DC Movie Universe)…Superman’s gallery of rogues include Luthor who may be out of jail by the time the JL films happens, Darkseid, Braniac….Batman’s rogue gallery include Mr. Freeze, Joker, Penguin, Two-Face, Ra’s Al Ghul, Clayface, Deadshot. I think it’d made sense for Deadshot, Joker or both (Joker would probably be accompanied I imagine by Harley Quinn) to be in JL since Batman’s set to cameo in Suicide Squad if I am not mistaken. I’d like to see Green Lantern, Green Arrow and Manhunter in JL with Sinestro and one of Arrow’s & Manhunter’s villains being on the villain side.

ironically, michael keaton would have been PERFECT at this age, since the movie takes things from the death of superman and the dark knight returns, a really old batman would have been great. a tad unbelievable by movide standards, but great specially if it was keaton.

i actually liked this movie. since i read both comics i understood the references a lot more than the people around me who were wondering what the fuck was going on

Good point would have been good to see him back again.

I didn’t read your essay yet, but I don’t understand all the damn negativity. Never before in my young adult life have I seen one single film (of this magnitude) get so much hate, especially given how young the film is. For Christ’s sake, it’s still in theaters.

I enjoyed the movie and even planned on (GASP) seeing it again. Was it perfect? Absolute not. Few films these days are. But it serves it’s purpose: it was a fun/entertaining popcorn flick that kept me entertained for 2 and a half hours. It was faithful to the comic book(s?) it was derived from. That right there is a big deal in and of itself.

If I’m one of the few people on planet earth who liked it, so be it. I’d rather be a rarity and say that it was a good film than have such negativity and hatred for one movie.

Furthermore, if you haven’t seen the movie – don’t speak. Keep your trap closed. Forever. You have no right to an opinion until you’ve see it.

Yeah, I mean, I guess it was that people had a set way in their mind of what they wanted it to be, and it wasn’t that way, so now a lot are shitting on it, when it doesn’t really deserve it at all.

I haven’t seen it myself, but I imagine it’s a decent film, taking a different (possibly unique), more mature direction for once.

Yeah, I mean, I guess it was that people had a set way in their mind of what they wanted it to be, and it wasn’t that way, so now a lot are shitting on it, when it doesn’t really deserve it at all.

I think this is exactly what happened to me with Fury Road. I had a pretty good idea in my mind of what I wanted it to be /what I thought it would be. When it turned out to be something else, I didn’t shit on the film like people are doing to BvS. Yeah I was a little let down, but I got over it and now I love the film.

Maybe too any people were expecting something completely different and are just being whiny children about it.

Never have I seen a movie that makes me wonder if a general consensus is even a good idea these days.

So. Many. Split. Opinions.

Personally, it satisfied the little boy in me.
Everyone did great a job. No bad actor in my book.
It presented a lot of things of things that were new to superhero movies.
Despite not being well executed, interesting conflicts were brought up.
The cameos were cool, even if it felt thrown in.
Action was good. Better than the people being constantly being thrown around in MoS.
Didn’t depress me, unlike most people. (It’s a strange complaint)
It made an achievement by actually making me tear up at the end. (I don’t really cry like when I was younger).
Definitely made me want to see the Extended Cut, especially if it’s released in theaters.
My biggest praise would be deviating from the source material, since it allows it to be it’s own thing. (Lex shone the best in this regard)

Granted, as an actual movie, it’s pretty bad.
The editing is insanely wonky, especially in the beginning.
The music did not fit certain scenes.
The script is very all over the place, something that would’ve been fixed in it’s original 4 hour version.
Superman and Batman are basically crazy people in the movie, despite it still being a different interpretation.
Superman felt like a side character, despite this originally being his movie. Seriously, Lois has more lines than him.
Speaking of, Lois was very shoved in the last act.
Wonder Women, despite being amazing, didn’t need to be in this movie.
Doomsday didn’t also need to be here. He was used too early.
The DCEU setups were pretty rushed and forced.
Lastly, I think Zack Synder has a misunderstanding of death. That is all.

Despite all that, if you look at this as some weird artsy fanboy project than an actual movie, you’ll enjoy it better.

All it took was one trigger word for Bats to return to his childhood… Gotta love that scene.

But honestly, the only thing that really bothered me was what they did to Lex. They made him a little too…Riddler-ish. Or maybe Loki’d him given how much Bats Vs. Supes took cues from the Avengers.

All it took was one trigger word for Bats to return to his childhood… Gotta love that scene.

That will now remain one of my favorite moments in any movie.

But honestly, the only thing that really bothered me was what they did to Lex. They made him a little too…Riddler-ish. Or maybe Loki’d him given how much Bats Vs. Supes took cues from the Avengers.

Honestly, I really like the portrayal. Again, it’s that whole interpretation thing, where it creates it’s own versions of things.
God knows how much more we would’ve had to deal with the Donner Lex, despite being a good portrayal.

As I wrote on another forum…

If I could sue Warner Bros for those two-and-a-half wasted hours, I would. Speaking from a purely filmmaking perspective, leaving out all of my personal, historical and heretofore well-known issues with the portrayal of characters, BvS: DOJ is absolute garbage.

Boring. Poorly paced. The few action scenes that take place before the "epic grand finale" with Doomsday are both poorly shot and paint-by-numbers predictable, with perhaps one exception. What few attempts at humor there were — apart from Alfred’s dry quips — are just awkward and stilted, like nearly every other bit of dialogue in the film. With the exception of Bruce Wayne, none of the major players has a real motivation for any of their actions in the film. And the "Martha" turning point near the end was even more painful, awkward, hamfisted and asinine than I thought it would be based on the script.

Two-and-a-half hours of "heroes" who mope around, stare intently at nothing, and prove themselves to be utterly ineffectual at doing anything worthwhile, and a villain who comes off as nothing more menacing or genius than a petulant kindergartner on a sugar rush, whose grand scheme has no foundation, no motivation, and no purpose. Kevin Spacey’s Gene Hackman caricature and his been-there-done-that-make-a-land-grab enterprise from Superman Returns made more sense.

The few good moments of the film involve either Gal Gadot or Jeremy Irons. Ben Affleck works just fine for the material, but then, so would a wax dummy of Ben Stein. Amy Adams phones it in, while Jesse Eisenberg chews more scenery than a hedge-trimmer at a topiary convention, and not in a good way. I actually defended Henry Cavill’s performance in Man of Steel, but what seemed merely understated there, turns to utterly flat, stupendously awkward, and just plain bad here.

Special mention must go towards the lighting. It’s bad. I mean, unspeakably bad. I know the film is supposed to be "dark." But that is no excuse to make it visually painful to watch. The worst professor I ever knew taught a lighting class, and on her worst student’s worst day, they wouldn’t have done such a hackneyed job. The special effects, overall, don’t fare much better. Everything about the film feels like a rush job, and from what I know wound up on the cutting room floor, a butchery in editing.

It’s a limp, lifeless, and more importantly, dull, dreary and dreadful disaster. There would have been more energy in an arthouse film staring Ryan Gosling as the corpse of Marcel Marceau.

Kudos to Jeremy Irons, applause for Gal Gadot, condolences for Ben Affleck and Laurence Fishbourne, and shame on everyone else associated with this unholy trainwreck.

People Expected it ro Be a Light Hearted Family Film like The Avengers. It was not it was dark like the graphic novels it is based on, going back to routes of these types of Films like Batman (1989) and Batman Returns.

I loved it, again it had one or two scenes where i was like oh come on, i loved the cast and story, and I hope the other DC Movies (should we get a long Movie universe) are just as dark and maybe more, like the books!

And honestly Marvel could take a leaf from it and make their films more dark and suspensful (which it appears they have with CA CW) 😛

BRING ON SUICIDE SQUAD, WONDER WOMAN AND MORE!

no i do not believe people expected it to be a light-hearted film considering its predecessor was just as dark

people do not dislike it because it’s dark

Then why do people dislike it? :p

Then why do people dislike it? :p

People dislike it because it’s too long, it’s badly paced, some of the characters are badly written (just try and tell me what Lex’s motivations for hating Batman and Superman and for doing anything were, go on, I’ll wait), it’s incredibly self indulgent, Zack Snyder arrogantly assumes he’s made the best superhero film ever (just look at his comments about the film and his comments bad mouthing Marvel that prove how arrogant he is), the editing is terrible and the film is just joyless and not fun to watch at all. It’s oppressively one note and dour. This is not because it’s dark, it’s just because there’s no sense of fun. Even other dark superhero films (The Dark Knight Trilogy, Captain America: The Winter Soldier, Watchmen, The Wolverine and Dredd for example) are still fun to watch. This is not asking for more humor or anything. It just needs a sense of fun. A movie starring Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman should not be this dull to watch. This is why critics hated it. And honestly, even though I did like the film and what it tried to do, I agree with them. It’s not an enjoyable movie to watch. There is no fun at all. Even 2014’s Godzilla which is incredibly dark, has very little humor and is very similar in tone and style to Batman v Superman was still fun and an enjoyable movie experience. Batman v Superman is not and it has a lot of problems. Sure these could be fixed by the extended cut, but I’m not too hopeful. At best the film is a flawed mess that isn’t terrible, but not great either.

DC makes the childish mistake of thinking that dark = realistic. It doesn’t.

As a lifelong Batman fan, I really wanted this movie to be good, but it really wasn’t!
It is way too long, badly paced and the editing is terrible, it just goes from one scene to another without any transitions.
The Action scenes are not exciting, there’s too many characters that are just there without having anything to do. I love Amy Adams but you could tell they had no idea what to do with Lois Lane, especially in the third act. The whole movie she was just a damsel in distress.
The Batman v Superman fight was actually entertaining but the reason behind it was pretty bad, the reason why they stopped fighting was even worse!
Superman became a side character with nothing to say and just looked angry all the time, Lex Luthor and the whole third act with Doomsday was absolute shit!
Batman was the most interesting character, and Ben Affleck did really good. The only scene I really liked was when he rescued Martha.
Also the score was mostly pretty bad, and felt really out of place in most scenes.
The cameos from the other members of the Justice League felt so forced, and Aquaman looked ridiculous.
Also the fact that Luthor already gave them names and their symbols makes no sense!
This movie had so much potential and such a great cast, but it’s a huge wasted opportunity!
There were other things that I didn’t like but you get the point!

At this point of time, I should say again that as an actual movie, it didn’t work.
If I wanted a legitimate movie from both these heroes,
Richard Donner and Christopher Nolan did well with their films.
Call me biased, seeing as Superman The Movie & Batman Begins were part of my childhood.
But those movies can easily stand alone in the test of time.
BvS was too concerned with competing with Marvel, and suffered for it.
I still enjoyed it, but it definitely missed the mark.

All it took was one trigger word for Bats to return to his childhood… Gotta love that scene.

But honestly, the only thing that really bothered me was what they did to Lex. They made him a little too…joker-ish. Or maybe Loki’d him given how much Bats Vs. Supes took cues from the Avengers.

fixed that for you.

Then why do people dislike it? :p

you’re welcome to read any review and find out why. there is a higher than 90% chance you like it because you’re a lil baby boy, to be honest. which is fine.

That’s a good one.

The dislike of the film also stems from people not liking how dark Batman was portrayed – that he was willing to kill. Well what do you expect from a guy who’s been full of darkness and vengeance since seeing both of his parents murdered right in front of his eyes at 8 years old, then years later, he lost Robin to a murderer (presumably Joker?) He lost all his humanity aside from the portion of humanity that he acts when he goes around dressed as Bruce Wayne. As Batman, he rarely shows any traces of a human being (he doesn’t smile or rarely does, for example.) I see Batman as the main man and Bruce Wayne as the mask he puts on for the world because though he didn’t have the training, suit and gadgets at 8 years old, when his parents died, he and his life changed. Slowly going away was Bruce Wayne, eventually replaced by the darkness that is Batman. Didn’t he kill in one of the recent comics? If so, Batman killing is no longer unheard of. Batman is a superhero to me in many ways. But he is a vigilante, he’s above (or outside) the law. Oliver Queen killed in season 1 of Arrow and like Batman, he’s a vigilante. People, myself included still liked that first season of the show.

If Joker really did kill Robin, then he’d be a good villain for the solo Batman film. Haven’t seen the Suicide Squad film yet (not out till August), but if Jared Leto’s Joker (no one’s gonna follow Nicholson or Ledger), then it’d be good to get him back for the solo Batman movie. In terms of continuity, it makes sense since Affleck’s Batman is gonna be in SS.

Finally managed to see it yesterday. I liked it, but really only partially – namely, the Batman part (never cared much for boy scout Superman). I thought I’d be bored by yet another take on the Dark Knight, I also heard before seeing the movie that he took to killing in this one which made me a bit worried (not that he didn’t kill in Burton’s envisioning of the character, mind you – but not en masse), but in the end I think it all turned out well, at least for the Bat himself. My biggest fear – that they will ruin Batman after (more or less) successful Nolan trilogy the way "Batman and Robin" did after Burton’s films – wasn’t fulfilled. I liked an older, darker Batman pushed to extreme measures (branding FTW!), I liked to see him more brutal and straightforward. Just kill ’em and be done with it, service to the world. And burdened by years under the mask ("I’m older now than my father ever was"). I’m really hoping for a solo Batfleck film now, but not another origin story, rather a continuation of that "older, darker" theme. As for the rest…I don’t know, I felt like Lois Lane was completely useless and don’t even get me started on Lex "Matchstick Man" Luthor. Superman was okay (despite his motivation to hate Batman being completely stupid and hypocritical), Wonder Woman…meh. Gal Gadot looks very fine, but I felt like her role was too small for me to care at all. Those Justlice League cameos were strange and kind of forced, but I hope they will take on Justice Lords scenario some day as it was hinted. A friend of mine who saw the movie earlier said that it essentialy is just a two-hours long trailer for the Justice League and it’s hard not to agree – and I really hate how practically every superhero movie nowadays is "hey, let’s throw in every superhero we have, it’ll be fun!". I miss solo flicks. So, in short: Batfleck FTW, the rest could have been much better, including the music.

I actually really loved the movie, considering what it became through the years: initially it had to be a Man of Steel 2 movie, and later it became a transition movie for the Justice League. Pratically it condenses most of the "DC Phase One" into one film, and it could have been far worse, in my opinion, and I don’t really feel I should condemn the movie for all the transition-movie-related problems (characters thrown in, teasing for the next movies)… It’s the exact same thing of The Force Awakens (its similarity to A New Hope): they decided to continue / expand the saga / universe, and they were forced to make it this way.

It is actually incredible that the brand-new Batman (that was decided later into pre-production) is the best thing of the movie. I enjoyed the visual style of the film: maybe, it’s not great in a filmmaking view, but at least has its own style, while most of Marvel movies have none (or maybe, I didn’t enjoy those). As for the music, I feel it could have been better, but again it has some new pieces and works with the scenes.
I actually enjoyed even the first half of the movie: all of the discussion about Superman, and the trial, was really good to me. I really appreciate Snyder’s effort to make something less all-out-action and try something more thoughtful. If might be too long, slow pieced, badly handled to some, but I’m ok with all that thing.

I have other things to say… but I prefer they come out in a discussion. And, also, I don’t want to bore you with my mediocre English 😀

I loved the music. Saw nothing wrong with it. I thought it fit the film well.

@HunterTech:

You’ll be able to see the extended cut. The Ultimate Edition blu ray will have the extended version of the film. I’m curious to see if the extended cut compliments the theatrical version and if it does, how. We now know that the Robin suit Wayne was looking at belongs to Jason Todd, killed by Joker. Will that reveal be in the extended cut, if not straight-forwardly, then via some kind of hint? The only thing I really disliked about the movie is the same thing I disliked about Man of Steel…..Henry Cavill. It’s not that he’s a bad actor. I just don’t see him being a good fit for Superman though honestly I’m not sure who would be. I’m curious to see how the actor they got to be Superman in Season 2 of Supergirl does in the role. And I didn’t buy Jesse as Luthor. It’s not that he did bad in the role. He did come off as Riddler-ish as was previously pointed out in this thread. Nothing wrong with humor. It’s actually good I think to have humor in a dark movie like this to sort of bring some bit of lightness to it otherwise it is way too dark which is too one sided which isn’t always good. But Lex, one of the main villains provided too much humor. That was where the problem was. Movie versions of The Joker got serious when they needed to be. Carrey’s Riddler, Carrey’s strength lie in comedy (Ace Ventura, The Mask), but I think his portrayal of The Riddler was serious when he needed to be too.

No live action Superman’s touching Christopher Reeve’s performance. Had he been alive, he’d be a perfect old Kent/old Superman if the live action went in the time travel to the future direction much like Keaton would be for an old Bruce Wayne/Batman. Yes this comment includes the TV shows which Flash and LoT are doing.

Superheroes like Superman and maybe even more so Batman are hard to cast because you have to find one actor who can do dual roles. Batman/Bruce Wayne, same guy, but it’s as if it’s two different people. It’s like Bruce is gone when the suit is on, but present when the suit’s off. Superman maybe not as hard because suit or glasses, not that much difference in him like Batman/Bruce Wayne.

Reading leaked details about the Ultimate Cut, it clears up various little issues and attempts to fix a big one (Superman being brooding), but it’s really looking like the same movie. Shame.

Well when the cut really comes out, won’t have to rely on leaks, will we? Then we’ll really see how "same" the film actually is. As curious as I am, doesn’t really matter to me as either way, I’ll have enough Bat-Affleck till I see him again in Suicide Squad. As much as I liked the movie, he saved it. No doubt about that.

And I didn’t buy Jesse as Luthor. It’s not that he did bad in the role. He did come off as Riddler-ish as was previously pointed out in this thread. Nothing wrong with humor. It’s actually good I think to have humor in a dark movie like this to sort of bring some bit of lightness to it otherwise it is way too dark which is too one sided which isn’t always good. But Lex, one of the main villains provided too much humor. That was where the problem was.

To me it was fine with that kind of Riddler-ish / humor attitude. I think that Lex Luthor as seen in BvS isn’t (yet) the Lex Luthor we should expect. That’s why the long hair: he’s almost a different character. Now that they’re cut off, we are allowed to expect a "real" Lex Luthor in the next movies.

@Imperivm:

Yeah that’s a great point. BvS was basically Lex Luthor Begins. When Bale’s Bruce Wayne first became a vigilante in Batman Begins (or Kevin Conroy’s Bruce Wayne Batman: Mask of the Phantasm as it relates to animation as it showed a flashback scene of what I’m about to say), he was not in the Bat-Suit. He had black clothing, including a ski mask and he messed up on grappling as he hadn’t mastered that yet. So like he eventually got the suit in Begins, Luthor will be the Lex we know in the next DC film he appears in.

His humor wasn’t bad. if it was me making the movie, I wouldn’t have made him so humorous is all. He was Riddler-ish in almost every scene he was in. Could have been toned down a little bit on that. Doesn’t mean it was bad though.

The first time we see them, it’s not what we know. it evolves to eventually get to that. I brought up Bruce Wayne. Tobey Maguire’s Peter Peter in Sam Raimi’s Spiderman where Peter’s first crime cleaning act was in a spider version of what Bruce was wearing in his first night of vigilantism. Later on the film, Parker would have the Spiderman suit we know him to be in. For thos who are/were wrestling/Undertaker fans, Taker wasn’t quite the Taker we know the legend to be. When he first debuted, it was clear he hadn’t completely gotten into the character yet. The character is known to be slow, not talk much, not smile/laugh. During his first couple of months, he was noticeably moving somewhat fast for a slow, methodical deadman in the ring, talked more than just a few words in interviews, smiled/laughed a few times, albeit evilly.