Evangelion is my favorite anime, therefore I enjoy talking about it. However, whenever I try to do so online, I find that most discussion about it is nonsense and I become an Angry Internet Man. It seems that I like the show for very different reasons than the rest of the fandom. I also agree with much of what the haters say. I've been lurking for a while, and have found many reasonable opinions in these forums, so I wanted to post why I love the show and wonder if anyone will want to discuss.

NGE may have the best characterization of any anime series. The main cast (the three pilots and misato) have very distinct, well developed personalities. All of these personalities (the shy guy, the brooding, mysterious girl, the obnoxious girl, the flamboyant girl/mother figure) are common in anime, however they are almost always just a gimmick, a distinctive trait to give flavor to the character. In NGE, they are actual characterization, for three-dimensional characters. They ring true.

Take for instance Shinji, the main character. He's cripplingly shy and insecure. If you are or have been shy yourself, you will probably identify with him often. You may be surprised at how accurate and subtle some of his actions and attitudes are. For instance, there is a scene in which he has just scored well in a test, and is feeling pretty good about himself, a rare sight. Then he sees a couple of little kids laughing and looking in his direction. You can just see his confidence evaporate as he thinks they are making fun of him. If you've ever felt like that, that's a powerful scene.

Seeing him interacting with other equally well-fleshed characters is a joy. You can just sense his awkwardness and their frustration and annoyance. You can feel the little bits of progress.

There are countless animes in which a shy male protagonist becomes goes to live with an attractive flamboyant woman. This is the only time where it feels like a logical development within the story, consistent with their personalities, and where the ensuing relationship between them seems realistic and not some dude's fantasy.

Also, secondary characters too are very well characterized, and always fun to see interacting with the main cast (especially misato/ritsuko and asuka/kaji). Very rarely you get such well developed characters, in anime or live action TV. The sopranos have more nuanced characters, but few other shows have. So to me that's the first and biggest reason to like the show.

After that it's much of the story itself, and the atmosphere. On the surface it has a fairly generic giant robots vs aliens theme. But that's like saying that Lost is just about survival in a haunted island. The whole thing is imbued with a very effective sense of mystery. The mechas grow on you, and you can't help wondering just what they are. Ditto for the angels; It's not clear what the hell they are or where they come from. You can also see that there's something wrong with the organization (NERV) that's supposed to save the world. The city (and world) is eerie, post-apocalyptic and beautiful at the same time. Like in the beginning of lost, there's an atmosphere that's hard to describe but that compels you to want to find out what happens next, and what are the details of that world.

Other good things are the occasionally superb (but uneven) directing and art, and the great soundtrack which are big parts of the reason it has such a great atmosphere. Fights are quite cool, and a some of the high points in the series (like unit 3) are really very high.

Now, there are good reasons to dislike the series, and they seem to be what the internet fandom seems to like best about the show. I'm actually very curious to see how many share my feelings on this.

At first the plot moves slowly, but you catch glimpses of what seems like a deeper story that's interesting and coherent. As in the first seasons of lost, that effectively keeps your expectations up and makes you anticipate the rest of the show. But the story eventually becomes a jumbled mess (to some, that's when it gets good). It becomes pretentious, vague, meaningless garbage. It feels like the creators threw out all of their meticulous pacing and exposition and decided they could do no wrong, and mistook self-indulgence for profoundness. I won't say anything about the, ahem, symbolism.

That's not to say it's all bad. Some of what little you can discern of the clumsily told storyline is still interesting. Good sci-fi, even. Much of the characterization is still strong (while some, such as Ritsuko, becomes a trainwreck). A few of the abstract introspection scenes are interesting and insightful (while most are tedious drivel).

I had hopes for the Rebuild movies, but what I've seen so far (the first) has destroyed the pacing and thrown away all but the most basic of characterization, while playing up the vague, pretentious angle. I don't know whether they will tell a coherent story, but I know that there's little reason to follow it. I will concede that art, animation and the soundtrack are awesome, and basically porn for the eva fan.

So there. Most fans I've encountered believe that EVA is a seminal work into which you can peer and glimpse the true nature of mankind. Or something like that. I believe it's an amazing show with a crappy ending. What do you think?

I watched 2 episodes of Eva on Toonami and thought it was a long and boring gundam with Charlie Brown & Lucy.

Then Adult Swim aired all 26 episodes but I wasn�t able to see it from the start and the bits I did see didn�t seem like they where all that thrilling.
So for years I just ignored the series not because of my past experiences with it but more the way people acted whenever Eva was mentioned, I just could not get an honest or level headed response about it.
Around fall 2008 I was looking for something to watch late night and just figured what the hell.

And I loved it.

The best way to describe Eva is that it�s the Watchmen of giant robot anime. When you take into account that most of the merchandizing and promotional work I�ve seen feature Asuka & Rei going to the beach, having slumber parties, racing BMX bikes, as a NASCAR pit crew, and are generally the best of friends with strong lesbian overtones I was floored by the actual characters and themes that the story evolved into.

The story might be a big mess a lot of the time but it isn�t anything so convoluted that you can�t figure it out and alien invasions and government conspiracies are a dime a dozen. What you�re really watching for is the characters and interactions between them.
It�s been far too long since I genuinely cared about the characters in a series and hoped that they�d be able to overcome their all too inevitable fate.

Evangelion is one of my favortie series, I like the characters, the action and mysteries thatr are never full resolved. (Gotta admit I've wanted to slap Shinji now and again) With the remakes and huge amount of merchandising I think it has become trendy to hate Evangelion. Episdoe 26 didn;t help much either, although if the rumors are true that Hideaki Anno made it like that to mess with the fans I like it even more. I onced used Evangelion as a subject for a paper in collge and gave my proffesor a copy of the series when the semester ended.




The best way to describe Eva is that it’s the Watchmen of giant robot anime.


could you elaborate on that? I never thought of it that way, then again I only read Watchmen after the movie hype started



When you take into account that most of the merchandizing and promotional work I’ve seen feature Asuka & Rei going to the beach, having slumber parties, racing BMX bikes, as a NASCAR pit crew, and are generally the best of friends with strong lesbian overtones I was floored by the actual characters and themes that the story evolved into.



I've seen that to,although most of it was fanart/fic but it adds another layer of why I love this series, seeing where the fans take it in fan art, fan fics and dojins. I've written my share of bad Eva Fan fics on the old SDAT datbase when the series was new.

On a side note, is it my imagination or does Shinji seem have more backbone in "You Are Not Alone"?

I agree with everything Tom's Toonami Tunes said. Which is good, it saves me having to type it all out. Thanks Tom. :)

Evangelion is one of my favortie series, I like the characters, the action and mysteries thatr are never full resolved. (Gotta admit I've wanted to slap Shinji now and again) With the remakes and huge amount of merchandising I think it has become trendy to hate Evangelion. Episdoe 26 didn;t help much either, although if the rumors are true that Hideaki Anno made it like that to mess with the fans I like it even more. I onced used Evangelion as a subject for a paper in collge and gave my proffesor a copy of the series when the semester ended.



could you elaborate on that? I never thought of it that way, then again I only read Watchmen after the movie hype started




I've seen that to,although most of it was fanart/fic but it adds another layer of why I love this series, seeing where the fans take it in fan art, fan fics and dojins. I've written my share of bad Eva Fan fics on the old SDAT datbase when the series was new.

On a side note, is it my imagination or does Shinji seem have more backbone in "You Are Not Alone"?

What I understand of the making of Eva is this: After completing I think Nadia, Hideki Anno went through 4 years a severe depression where he didn't do anything at all and just gave up on everything. He managed to overcome this. Gainax was looking for a new show and Anno just getting back in the saddle pitched an original story idea. Gainax figure why not let's give him a shot at it.

For the most part Anno had a general idea of what the story would be about and how many things would play out but for whatever reason he was also flexible with it and things would change from episode to episode as they made it. Well, about half way through he had a nervous breakdown and went through a bunch of stuff and all those new experiences greatly affected the tone and direction of the show; things became way darker, and more psychological, which the network and the advertisers weren't too happy about. You see they thought Eva was just going to be some cheap romantic comedy/drama gundam-like show for little kids. And they advertised it as such. The 2 more brutal fights and Misato & Kaji's love scene irked the sponsors enough for several of them to pull their funding. This coupled with not always being able to meet deadlines meant the development team had to get creative with the last several episodes, i.e. clip shows with monologues, and more still frames.

Episodes 25 & 26 were meant to be "The End of Evangelion" but they had no money left and hardly any time so that's why it's a vague group inner monologue clip show bonanza. With the huge success of the show, Anno began work on Death and Rebirth which along with bringing people up to speed with a show that has been off the air for a few years also gave him an opportunity to re-animate rushed scenes and add ones that got cut. Then he fallowed up with the actual end to the story End of Eva.

Both TV and Movie endings are correct, TV end is happening inside instrumentality, while the movie is what's happening in real life.

For the most part Anno had a general idea of what the story would be about and how many things would play out but for whatever reason he was also flexible with it and things would change from episode to episode as they made it. Well, about half way through he had a nervous breakdown and went through a bunch of stuff and all those new experiences greatly affected the tone and direction of the show; things became way darker, and more psychological, which the network and the advertisers weren't too happy about. You see they thought Eva was just going to be some cheap romantic comedy/drama gundam-like show for little kids. And they advertised it as such. The 2 more brutal fights and Misato & Kaji's love scene irked the sponsors enough for several of them to pull their funding. This coupled with not always being able to meet deadlines meant the development team had to get creative with the last several episodes, i.e. clip shows with monologues, and more still frames.

It's nice you pointed that out. Almost every Eva hater I talked to always said that the ending was one of the main reasons for hating the show, but neither really cared why it ended like that.

Evangelion is one of my favortie series, I like the characters, the action and mysteries thatr are never full resolved. (Gotta admit I've wanted to slap Shinji now and again) With the remakes and huge amount of merchandising I think it has become trendy to hate Evangelion. Episdoe 26 didn;t help much either, although if the rumors are true that Hideaki Anno made it like that to mess with the fans I like it even more. I onced used Evangelion as a subject for a paper in collge and gave my proffesor a copy of the series when the semester ended.



could you elaborate on that? I never thought of it that way, then again I only read Watchmen after the movie hype started




I've seen that to,although most of it was fanart/fic but it adds another layer of why I love this series, seeing where the fans take it in fan art, fan fics and dojins. I've written my share of bad Eva Fan fics on the old SDAT datbase when the series was new.

On a side note, is it my imagination or does Shinji seem have more backbone in "You Are Not Alone"?

I guess I didn't answer your questions Darkliger.

At the time when Alan Moore was making Watchmen almost all comic books where like the Adam West Batman, fun, wacky, the same elements reused over and over and not all that serious. Pretty much considered kids stuff. Watchmen took all those story & character conventions that have been a staple since the golden age and twisted them into something the familiar but way different from anything done before. It showed that you could do adult stories with heroes that are far from perfect in a dark and serious world which deals with serious real life issues.

Eva kinda did the same thing but with anime.

I like Rei. Especially in Angel form. We tried to birth a new angel, but Rei is so big see, I had to increase my own size, but then we where worried about people watching, so instead we went out for ice cream. She likes rainbow sherbet.

I guess I didn't answer your questions Darkliger.

At the time when Alan Moore was making Watchmen almost all comic books where like the Adam West Batman, fun, wacky, the same elements reused over and over and not all that serious. Pretty much considered kids stuff. Watchmen took all those story & character conventions that have been a staple since the golden age and twisted them into something the familiar but way different from anything done before. It showed that you could do adult stories with heroes that are far from perfect in a dark and serious world which deals with serious real life issues.

Eva kinda did the same thing but with anime.

Didn't know that about Watchmen. very interesting thanks for clearing it up.

New update: Evangelion 2.22 You Cannot Advance Blue Ray has sold 357,00 copies making it the best selling Blue Ray disk in japan, beating out the previouos record holder Micheal Jackson's "This is It"

Speaking of EVA 2.22, anyone watched it?

My jaw fell to the floor at the end of the movie.

Speaking of EVA 2.22, anyone watched it?

My jaw fell to the floor at the end of the movie.

If been out now for a while in japan there should be some high quality torrents of the dub. I'll hunt one down once I find a new cheap monitor.

^ There's one somewhere, my bf found it and watched it. He said it was a total mindf***.... I have yet to see it.

There are no dubs as far as I know and it's not known yet when it'll come out. If there is a fan dub out there, it's super hidden, because it took me several hours just to find proper subs.

*bonks head* I was talking about a sub. But it was dvd quality though....

Damn I meant subtitles as well.




^ There's one somewhere, my bf found it and watched it. He said it was a total mindf***.... I have yet to see it.

I've been spoiled quite a bit on 2.0, mainly from the toys discussion. (protip: don't look up anything about the Toy Story 3 legos because I think they gave a big surprise away) Even if I didn't know anything I doubt that it's anywhere near as traumatizing as End of Eva.


I liked the 1st retake movie but I'm unsure of the series as a whole.
I get why you would want to remake Eva as 4 movies to make it more accessible to the mass public and to clarify all the things Anno wasn't able to do because of the problems I stated above.
But it's not a straight up remake it's a whole new entity and what's worse the first and last scene in 1.0 heavily imply a time loop or some such tomfoolery and if that's the case that pretty much kills the making it easy for new fans to join in angle.

Then the fact that the first one is in many scenes are shot for shot word for word remake of the TV show but 2.0 sounds like it's changed alot of things and added new stuff is further puzzling. Why not just make a brand new story right off the bat.

And finally if/when the Peter Jackson produced live action movies are made they're gonna cover almost the very same ground as these movies.

I'm not hating on them I'm just setting back, enjoying then and wondering "why?"

Oh ya, I watched 2.22 with my bf the other night............ it made my brain hurt.......

At least your brain didn't explode.

Now I remember. Shinji is well developed as a character - in fact, too well; people like him piss me off a lot. Rei is annoying, for these reasons I just can't get into watching it again. I have the series plus the EoE on a backup hard drive. I did enjoy the Eva fights. The whole giant Rei thing makes me laugh now that I think about it.

Would you like TEH REI if she was brown Argus?

at first i find it really boring but later on i started to enjoy it...

Would you like TEH REI if she was brown Argus?




You bastard ;D

(http://www.pimpandhost.com/image/3659742-original.html)

One of the things that suprized me as well as made me like the series was the "realistic" plot points. In almost every sci-fi fantasy the odds are way out balanced but the heroes win anyway; sometimes it's done naturally and cleverly sometimes it's a deus ex machima that just steamrolls over everything. But with Eva we get so see what happens if Frodo didn't have a Sam, if Han Solo didn't come back to shoot Vader out of the trench or if Peter Parker never had an Aunt May to fight for or an Uncle Ben to teach him about his great power.

Most of the tragaties in the story could have been at the very least lessened, Shinji, Asuka, & Rei could have been a well oiled fighting force but they never really got it together so people got hurt, people died and the hero often arrived too late to save the day complety.

Of course in the end everyone can have a happy ending anyway but that was important to give the main 4 an obtainable state of happyness that they'd need to reach themselves.

Fascinating insight there.

Also, that pic, Outlaw Star thugs?

Fascinating insight there.

Also, that pic, Outlaw Star thugs?

Not quite, from left to right they're the angels Lilith, Tab Cola, Satchel with toilet paper arms behind, and Double Jeopardy.



Anyone read the Eva Manga? In search of Scott Pilgrim I went to a small branch 1 town over and they have quite a few of them.
What I like about them is:

-Sadamoto who designed everything for the show is drawing it so it's like literal book of the cartoon.

-He doesn't just have everyone dress in the same cloathes evey time we see them.

-Misato calls Shinji "Shin-chan"

-Not even 4 volumes in and we get wet naked Misato booty and cute little Rei nipples

What's not good is that there are some big changes to the story and characters. Take Asuka's introduction: We first see her in an arcade playing a UFO claw game. WHAT THE HELL? Why is she after stuffed toys and dolls? This is so out of character and then things get real fan fictiony when she beats up like 6 guys one of whom she takes out with a Xena flip attack. And then there's her personality which instead of being tsundere she's now a malicious cunt and pretends to be sweet and nice to shinji when every one's looking but is super cruel to him when they're alone.

...

What's not good is that there are some big changes to the story and characters. Take Asuka's introduction: We first see her in an arcade playing a UFO claw game. WHAT THE HELL? Why is she after stuffed toys and dolls? This is so out of character and then things get real fan fictiony when she beats up like 6 guys one of whom she takes out with a Xena flip attack. And then there's her personality which instead of being tsundere she's now a malicious cunt and pretends to be sweet and nice to shinji when every one's looking but is super cruel to him when they're alone.



Asuka as Xena... Do want. I'm going to have to 'shop that. Since I hate Shinji, I'm totally cool with her mistreating his pussyass. I'm going to read the manga now just for that! [/grinchsmile]

Thing is
She's a cunt about it. TV Asuka is Sweet and happy to those she likes and wrathful and cruel to those she doesn't. No dihonesty, no manipulations just "I Am Asuka and if you don't like it suck my dick!" Comic Asuka gets in a fight over dolls and stuffed toys (why would Sadamoto even do this?) and after beating up about 6 guys when asked about the incedant the says that Shinji was the one who saved her and threatens him if he tatals on her.

1 - TV Asuka would never want a doll.
2 - She'd never let Shinji of all people take credit for doing something like that.
3 - She's almost a reverse tsundere pretending to be nice and get along with everyone when actually she hates everyone.

You guys should read the Shinji Ikari Raising Project. It's pretty good, and much better than Angelic Days.

Well just finished vol. 5, 6, & 7 and the things of note are

There are many things that get mixed together like Misato's promotion/ Asuka moing in party and Kaji & Misato returning from a box social. Because of this many importan things never happen like Misato checking if Shinji is doing ok being with so many people at the party or her confession on how she thinks she's a honorable person who and how she needed to get drunk just to say so.

Almost everyone except Hikari knew about Toji being the 4th child before unit 03 angel'd. Also his spleen was ruptured, his left leg was severed below the knee, massive cranial damage and he totally died.

We get Some info on Kaji. his he and his brother where orphaned during 2nd impact and he got caught stealing food from an army base, they made him squeal and tell them where the rest of his posse is and while Kaji escaped his brother and the rest of his friends where killed.

So it turns out he's just like Misato and can't be happy because someone died so that he could live.

Here's a fun find Eva Tarot Cards.


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Now I don't know nothing about no tarot but shouldn't Shinji be the hermet, Misato & Kaji be the lovers, Asuka's mother be the Hanged Man, & why is freaking Kaworu the moon when Rei's been associated with it since the first episode? It's nice that Maya got a card and I do love the world card though why some of them are dressed up while others are in default clothes is weird. And there are not sticks, spades, or pentagons cards just the face ones.

^ Well depending on when these were printed I could kinda understand why Kaworu is the on the moon card.......


Shinji on the Justice card makes me want to slam my face on the table -__-

I think they're newer seeing as how Monster Lilith has the rebuild mask on. (I liked the purple seele one better)
But still they kept the shot of her standing in front of the moon and they still use fly me to the moon.

At least Misato & Asuka got nice pinup art and the shadow effect on Ristuko doing science is cool.

Mmmmm, Asuka~