I picked up a copy of Star Ocean: Till The End Of Time on a whim without knowing anything about the game (or the series).

I am now aware that there are games that preceded this title. Is it necessary to play the other games prior to playing this one because it will make references to past events that might confuse me? Or is each game its own story (i.e. Final Fantasy minus the spin-offs)?

SO:ToT was my first too; playing the game it was evident that there was backstory that would have enhanced the experience, nevertheless I really really enjoyed it!! Excellent game - and well hard in places.

There's bits an pieces -- references to other races and planets and stuff that might enrich the story but I doubt are necessary. I only got about halfway through SO3 so maybe there's other references later on I'm not aware of.

They're all kind of their own game. Yes, there are references, but even then each game can hold its own. I first played Star Ocean: The Second Story...and had never even heard of the first (since at the time it was only in Japan with a half-translated snes rom floating around). I've since played the first...but anyway yeah. All of em are worth playing, especially since they have remakes out. I remember Star Ocean 2 on Universe mode was fucking ridiculous. The Ten Wise Men were near fucking impossible.

Cool, thanks for the info!

I think I'll wait off on it and order Second Story before playing TEoT.

Even if some references are made, I'm one of those nitpicky players that wants to know everything in the storyline ^^

Second Story is a great game mayyam! But yes each have there own story.

I got the feeling some of the characters you meet (especially the optional ones - that require running back and forth) had history of some kind that I was lacking.. maybe I was wrong - if so I'm sorry for misleading you mayyam (your name is a palindrome - nice!)

That's okay, Dr Faustus. I don't feel misled at all :)
I bought Second Story on eBay yesterday, so it's all good. Can't wait to start the series (after I finish FFIX, that is...)!

That's okay, Dr Faustus. I don't feel misled at all :)
I bought Second Story on eBay yesterday, so it's all good. Can't wait to start the series (after I finish FFIX, that is...)!

Thanx =)
hope you enjoy

yh I bought so3 it without knowing anything of the series (first real time rpg I played) although I did see so2 and never thought of buying it when it was first released but after playing so3 I had to get 2nd story, ended up forking out �65 for it. IMO so3 is one of the best rpgs on ps2 the battles are just too addictive!

I still liked Star Ocean 2 better than 3. 3 got so psychological.

Yeah time travel and space travel dont mix like in S04
they where good games but patchy and wierd stories, i rate the game on its gameplay which is pretty good.

The only thing SO had going for its self was the music and the gameplay. And also if you wanted to go back that far for SO you might as well get the ROM for the first one.

I recently purchased Star Ocean 4 (Haven't played that much of it yet), but my initial impressions so far are mediocre at best. I know it's set some time before the first Star Ocean, but that's about it I'm afraid :(

Star Ocean Til the End of Time I admit I enjoyed quite a bit, contrary to what some of my friends have said about it, there was something to it I enjoyed a lot more in comparison with Star Ocean The Second Story, but that's just me. I'm weird like that i guess.

I still need to beat Star Ocean: The First Departure, but my PSP broke.

SO:ToT is a really good game, i enjoyed it.

Also i played Second Story and the only thing i didn�t like about the game was the horrible AI of your partners

Really? I always thought the AI was fairly impressive in SO2, all things considered, at least.

Then again, regardless of who I chose at the beginning of the game, I often controlled Rena and let everyone else run wild. That way, I could heal effectively and still do some physical damage because in the 2nd half of the game, Rena isnt half bad. Plus, you can always switch characters mid battle if you need something specific? I guess magic casters (non healers) are kind of iffy. But I didn't use them much in SO2 after I had better options.

My psp broke when I was playing S02, I was defeating the last 2 ten wise men. That fiery head dude drove me up the wall.

My psp broke when I was playing S02, I was defeating the last 2 ten wise men. That fiery head dude drove me up the wall.

It just up and broke?

I picked up a copy of Star Ocean: Till The End Of Time on a whim without knowing anything about the game (or the series).

I am now aware that there are games that preceded this title. Is it necessary to play the other games prior to playing this one because it will make references to past events that might confuse me? Or is each game its own story (i.e. Final Fantasy minus the spin-offs)?

I consider star ocean 2 to be my favourite RPG of all time. Musically, it gets trounced by final fantasy, but the backdrops are splendid, and the combat system is incredibly fun and fast paced.

One item to note that I really enjoyed about 2 over 3, is that item creation can be performed anywhere. Run out of curatives in the dungeon, use "survival" or "call familiar" to retrieve ingredients, then "cook" or "compound" them into usable items.

Wicked, wicked game.

It just up and broke?

No, it went down into a stone floor really hard and fucked up, thats my way of finishing that boss battle, bet the game didnt expect that!

oh come now Keiser. you know it got tired of you pressing its buttons and yelling and screaming at it. "I have had it! Fuck this, I'll just break myself!"

I've played Star Ocean 3. The sheer amount of grinding pisses me off fairly often, along with every aspect of the Bonus Gauge. Since it fills by you attacking, it often pops up right when I'm trying to pull off an O attack, which makes it automatically give me the Increased Recovery thing. Also how it breaks so damn easily. D:<

It's also hard to find where you're going half of the time. Still trying to find the volcano or whatever that has this dragon I'm supposed to kill.

why does everybody hate to grind? i love grinding. it gives me a sense of self worth.

I've liked grinding in Disgaea and that's about it. Grinding eventually just gets boring for me.

i see.

Level grinding to the maximum level in SO3 (255) took me ages... But I eventually did it (Please don't ask me how long it took... just looking at the game case causes my thumbs to twitch spastically).

However... when compared to level grinding in other games, SO3 is in the middle imo. Compared with other console RPG's, yes SO3 can be quite boring... compare it with say FFXIO on the otherhand, and SO3 is a breeze.

i don't think it's boring. i love that game.

Nine says:
Dude you need the ******* thing in the workshop
The thing
that makes it
attack able


Izzy says:
what workshop


Nine says:
Don t fight it yet


Izzy says:
be more specific
o-o


Nine says:
You need to go in the kaddan workshop
it's some where around
before the
crystal boss

The first Star Ocean I ever touched was Till The End of Time. Then I beat the rest. Except for the 4th installment on 360/PS3. Other than that I never get tired of BLADE OF FURY!!!!!

Hate how you can't get all the characters on TTEOT..

SO:TTEOT is usually pretty fair, but does have some outrageous difficulty spikes at times (Robin Wind is an absolute bastard!) But you don't need to grind that much - you just need to be sensible about how you do it.

The trick is to make maximum (ab)use of the Triple EXP bonus. Whenever you get it, find a good area and keep grinding and grinding and grinding until you lose it, no matter how long it ends up taking (you'll lose it eventually, no matter how skillful you are).

By setting aside a hour or so every now and again early on to do this, you can power level so much, that you won't need to do any more grinding until well into the second disc.

But if you try to grind normally without taking advantage of Triple EXP and/or wait until you actually need to be harder, it will take ages to beef your party up to the levels they need to be.

A little pain now, saves a whole lot of hurt later...

And you can further enhance your power expotentially, by simply putting the effort into learning item synthesis properly. The game gives you many opportunities to get ahead of the difficulty curve, if you are willing to take them.

(For example, the best weapons on Elicoor II are in the first city you reach, so if you hoard your cash, you can return fairly soon and buy a weapon that massively eases the difficulty until Disc 2).

A lot of players just ignore the item synthesis and bonus gague, thinking they can muddle through, because RPGs are easy etc. So I think it should SO should be applauded for being a series that rewards a player who actually knows what they're doing, as opposed to just button bashing.


SO4 isn't as bad as the often numbingly slow opening 5-6 hours imply it will be. It is however a game where you really have to sit yourself down and just say 'I'm going to give this a chance'.

Because it often makes itself very difficult to love, suffering from some painfully emo and wangsty moments. You also have to accept that by and large, your crew are very far from being cool.

They're actually pretty charming in their own way, and develop a good dynamic, but if you're looking to command a ship of hard as nails space desperados... better to give the game a miss (or at least wait until you get the last party member).

But then maddeningly, it'll occasionally surprises you by suddenly becoming pretty ace. It's worth sticking with the game just to see the cutscene as your fleet assaults the enemy planet at the end. It's absolutely excellent -particularly the bit where one extremely irritating NPC gets an (intentionally) hilarious and thoroughly deserved death!

The combat is also superb, but that's always been a highlight of SO. They are both games that give out what you're willing to put in (both are crammed to the gills with extra dungeons, items, bosses, semi-hidden character developing private actions etc).

They're good people you know?

SO4 isn't as bad as the often numbingly slow opening 5-6 hours imply it will be. It is however a game where you really have to sit yourself down and just say 'I'm going to give this a chance'.

Because it often makes itself very difficult to love, suffering from some painfully emo and wangsty moments. You also have to accept that by and large, your crew are very far from being cool.

They're actually pretty charming in their own way, and develop a good dynamic, but if you're looking to command a ship of hard as nails space desperados... better to give the game a miss (or at least wait until you get the last party member).

But then maddeningly, it'll occasionally surprises you by suddenly becoming pretty ace. It's worth sticking with the game just to see the cutscene as your fleet assaults the enemy planet at the end. It's absolutely excellent -particularly the bit where one extremely irritating NPC gets an (intentionally) hilarious and thoroughly deserved death!

The combat is also superb, but that's always been a highlight of SO. They are both games that give out what you're willing to put in (both are crammed to the gills with extra dungeons, items, bosses, semi-hidden character developing private actions etc).

They're good people you know?

No, SO4 isn't bad... it's terrible (for me at least). The characters were unlikable to me, the music mediocre and the story was a yawnfest.

The story was clearly not for you, but that doesn't make it bad. Bad is something like White Knight Chronicles, Infinite Undiscovery etc.

The characters and story are geared towards a Star Trek 'optimistic future' kind of feel. The characters and stories are all tooled to examine the need for the 'Prime Directive' of the SO universe, the need to keep faith that things can be better etc.

If you�re just not into that sort of thing, then the game isn�t going to appeal, at least in terms of narrative. If you want to go on space adventures and �Be Badass in Space�, then WRPGs are the way to go.

That�s not to say that the game is some kind of perfect example of storytelling � the game's dialogue is of wildly uneven and frequently lamentably naive quality.

Some of the character work (particularly most of the PAs) is great, but some of the speeches are wince-inducingly Emo.

And the game takes its sweet old time to get going. The first half of the game can be summed up as 'Do you like Edge, Reimi, Lymle and Faize?' and 'Do you care about the romance versus reality of space exploration?'

If you don't, then you'll really struggle with the game, because the actual Good versus Evil story doesn't kick in properly until the second half of the game. The first half is about these factors and how they set up the conflict in the second half of the game.

I�m not going to pretend that the characters are the greatest ever, either. I would argue that whilst individually they are nothing special or original, they do work together very well as an actual party.

They are a team of characters, rather than 8-9 individual characters on the same ticket, as you get in many WRPGs.

The events of the first half of the game aren't great, I'll admit. Aeos is pretty good, but other than that, the early planets and locations promise much when you first arrive on them, before quickly become crushingly boring (Lemuris) or utterly ridiculous (Alternate Earth).

But I thought that from about the time you visit the Purgatorium on Roak, the game settles into a very nice groove and is highly enjoyable in story terms from there on out (its when things actually start happening). It�s also when the character work starts paying off.

But like many games, just as it starts getting really good, it ends. Highly frustrating and happening far too often these days.

SO4 isn�t the best JRPG ever, but just because a game isn't the greatest thing ever, that doesn't mean it's automatically utterly awful.

The basic framework of the story and characters are (to me anyway) fine, they just needed a good editor to go through and make the dialogue sound more natural. Less emo, less 'we keep moving forward, step by painful step' etc.

And okay, the game doesn't have the high production values of a Mass Effect 2 say, and the characters won't appeal to Western fans and their insatiable appetite to play as 'The Hardest And Coolest Man In The Universe'.

But the game has plenty going for it. Great combat, TONS of extra things to do both in game and post game, good difficulty levels. The competition for best JRPG of this gen is not high, but I still think that deeply flawed as it is, SO4 has to be up there.

I�m not blind to the game�s faults, (no-one could ever accuse me of being of a kind reviewer), but it isn�t anywhere near as bad as you say IMO.

The Star Ocean Games are known for the real time battles engines. Battles takes place on a separate screen. All characters are fully mobile in the three dimensions, can dodge and chase foes. It includes more fantasy games while now there is huge invention in the games like science fiction and space travel games.

The story was clearly not for you, but that doesn't make it bad. Bad is something like White Knight Chronicles, Infinite Undiscovery etc.

The characters and story are geared towards a Star Trek 'optimistic future' kind of feel. The characters and stories are all tooled to examine the need for the 'Prime Directive' of the SO universe, the need to keep faith that things can be better etc.

If you�re just not into that sort of thing, then the game isn�t going to appeal, at least in terms of narrative. If you want to go on space adventures and �Be Badass in Space�, then WRPGs are the way to go.

That�s not to say that the game is some kind of perfect example of storytelling � the game's dialogue is of wildly uneven and frequently lamentably naive quality.

Some of the character work (particularly most of the PAs) is great, but some of the speeches are wince-inducingly Emo.

And the game takes its sweet old time to get going. The first half of the game can be summed up as 'Do you like Edge, Reimi, Lymle and Faize?' and 'Do you care about the romance versus reality of space exploration?'

If you don't, then you'll really struggle with the game, because the actual Good versus Evil story doesn't kick in properly until the second half of the game. The first half is about these factors and how they set up the conflict in the second half of the game.

I�m not going to pretend that the characters are the greatest ever, either. I would argue that whilst individually they are nothing special or original, they do work together very well as an actual party.

They are a team of characters, rather than 8-9 individual characters on the same ticket, as you get in many WRPGs.

The events of the first half of the game aren't great, I'll admit. Aeos is pretty good, but other than that, the early planets and locations promise much when you first arrive on them, before quickly become crushingly boring (Lemuris) or utterly ridiculous (Alternate Earth).

But I thought that from about the time you visit the Purgatorium on Roak, the game settles into a very nice groove and is highly enjoyable in story terms from there on out (its when things actually start happening). It�s also when the character work starts paying off.

But like many games, just as it starts getting really good, it ends. Highly frustrating and happening far too often these days.

SO4 isn�t the best JRPG ever, but just because a game isn't the greatest thing ever, that doesn't mean it's automatically utterly awful.

The basic framework of the story and characters are (to me anyway) fine, they just needed a good editor to go through and make the dialogue sound more natural. Less emo, less 'we keep moving forward, step by painful step' etc.

And okay, the game doesn't have the high production values of a Mass Effect 2 say, and the characters won't appeal to Western fans and their insatiable appetite to play as 'The Hardest And Coolest Man In The Universe'.

But the game has plenty going for it. Great combat, TONS of extra things to do both in game and post game, good difficulty levels. The competition for best JRPG of this gen is not high, but I still think that deeply flawed as it is, SO4 has to be up there.

I�m not blind to the game�s faults, (no-one could ever accuse me of being of a kind reviewer), but it isn�t anywhere near as bad as you say IMO.

Sorry about the late reply Vrykolas, actually forgot about this thread...

I could post counterpoints to everything you said above, but in all honesty, I don't want to have a dragged out discussion. Far as I'm concerned though, Star Ocean The Last Hope is the weakest of the series.

The combat was nothing new, just a unimaginative rehash from the previous titles. The characters were weak for me, and I couldn't form any attachment with them whatsoever. The music was mediocre and flat for me. Only thing which was good, was the graphics and the overall designs of the starships, planets etc. Not good enough for me to keep the game though.

The 'Star Trek' feel of the characters you mentioned, while it did seem to be similar to Picard and the crew of the U.S.S. Enterprise D, it was a weak impersonation imo. That and I preferred Star Trek Deep Space Nine over The Next Generation and Voyager.

Even if it had the 'high production values of a Mass Effect 2', it just wasn't for me, and as a matter of fact I do enjoy space opera (films, novellas, games etc), this just failed to get me excited at all.

As I said I wasn't going to comment on each point you raised, however I will for the following points:


But the game has plenty going for it. Great combat, TONS of extra things to do both in game and post game, good difficulty levels. The competition for best JRPG of this gen is not high, but I still think that deeply flawed as it is, SO4 has to be up there.

Personally, I feel that JRPG's as a whole have lost a lot of the 'magic' they once had, and in most cases are seemingly tailored for a younger audience bracket, aka the 'Tweens' (Teenager to younger 20's.). Considering also that most of the JRPG's I have played over the years, at the time I loved them (I won't deny that.), however now playing them again I task myself 'What was so good about them?'. In short, over time and getting older, my tastes in games have matured to the point that games I once liked and enjoy, I may not now.


I�m not blind to the game�s faults, (no-one could ever accuse me of being of a kind reviewer), but it isn�t anywhere near as bad as you say IMO.

To each their own. I have read a few reviews for Star Ocean The Last Hope and almost all of them have raved on about how great it is. I have recently read a review about this game (As I was given a copy of this game by one of my cousins, so I 'might' give it another try... like when Hell freezes over), which I do agree with some of it, but I admit, it does take a somewhat angry view against it. Here's the link:

Review: Star Ocean: The Last Hope (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/editorials/reviews/5897-Review-Star-Ocean-The-Last-Hope)

Yo to the Man from Oz.

Well, fair enough. Like I said, a lot of it is down to 'Do you like JRPGs?', because it's a fairly good one, but if you just don't like them (anymore), then it was always going to be a tough sell.

The combat's good, but as you say, not an earthshaking step forward (but it's still better than the vast majority. I think it was a case of 'If it ain't broke'.

I prefer DS9 too, but as I assume you know if you bring it up at all, DS9 is considered to be only tenuously Star Trek at all. It had a very different feel and tone, and often had very different (darker) values.

That's not necessarily a bad thing, but I think the thing that still makes Star Trek (and JRGs) unique is their optimisitc, more moral and idealistic attitude to storytelling.

Not that they can't be dark (and not that WRPGs can't have moral characters in them), but JRPGs do tend to be more idealistic, whereas WRPG allow you to be the nastiest person ever, if you so choose.

Basically, JRPGs aren't very realistic in terms of how people actually speak, how society really is or would be etc etc. But they do have a place, telling more properly 'escapist', romantic stories, than the 'grim reality' of WRPGs.

As we all know, they walk a fine line indeed. JRPGs are always in danger of falling into the 'hideously scmaltzy' category, or being so sugary sweet that anyone playing it, instantly lapses into insulin shock.

Many of the values in JRPGs are easy to dismiss as sappy or dull etc etc. They always have to overcome the 'Good is Boring' idea. And yes, most of them are, to a greater or lesser degree (even the good ones).

But some of them just click with people, hence the legacy of grown lads (and girls) crying their eyes out to various powerful scenes, down the years!

I suppose its kind of like rediscovering how you thought life might be like, before the world came and along with its mundanity and human nature being what it is, sank in properly.

Anyway, I stand by my opinion that for better or worse, Star Ocean 4 is a good (if not great) JRPG. That might not be much, except for the fact that it's been such a terrible gen for JRPGs.

SO4, Eternal Sonata, and Tales of Vesperia have been the only decent ones, really. FF13 was... sort of okayish. I know you don't think much of it, but I thought it was alright (again though, it was far from great).