Last night Ive finished the game, and ive got some questions about the plot.
Spoilers


1) After Sin is defeated by the final summoning, Yu Yevon summns the final aeon to create a new Sin right? So when Yunalesca used her husband create her last aeonn, Yevon used him to create the new sin. Therefor there was no faith of Yunalesca's husband for other summoners to use. So why everybody in Spira beilives that by going to Zanakard s/he will find the faith to summon the final aeon?

2) Auron says that he rode Sin and entered Zanakard. The thing is, how Sin managed to enter Zanakard, if Zanakard is just a dream?

3) The faith tells Tidus that after the war of Zanakard-Bavelle, the few survivors became faith and were dreaming of how Zanakard used to be. If they were dreaming of how the city used to be, they should had been dreaming and how the people used to be. Does this mean that Tidus lived back then and died in the war? This could explain the appearance of that guy who looks like Tidus in FFX-2. The faith may had been dreaming about him, but only in appearance. What im trying to say is that the fayth may dreams of how the people were in Zanakard, but only in appearance. They cant dream of their characters and emotions, which makes the dreams having a difference character of the person they really used to be in Zanakard.


The final boss was lame btw ;)

1) It would depend on how many guardians the summoner had, after all, 1 had to be sacrificed, as did the summoner, and as Yuna says on the Mi'ihen Highroad, even for a few years of the Calm, it's worth it. Maybe any other guardians the summoner had felt the same way and refused to tell people the horrible truth?

2) Sin destroyed Zanarkand after the Machina War. Quoting Wakka "Then Sin came, and destroyed the Machina cities." This would explain why the Fayth dream of the destruction of Zanarkand. Auron rode Sin to Zanarkand because it existed in both worlds perhaps, and as he was already dead, he could easily be a dream of the Fayth? I don't know how Auron managed to ride Sin.... That's something for me to look up lol.

3) That's a possibility, however surely by dreaming about the destruction of Zanarkand differently (there was no war happening when Sin destroyed the Dream Zanarkand in FFX) the Fayth created essentially two distinct worlds. It's highly possible that the Fayth were trying to work out how they could have prevented Sin from destroying Zanarkand by dreaming of an infinite different possibilities, and Tidus and Shuyin come from two of those possibilities, therefore implying that there is a huge amount of Tidus' somewhere. Seems a bit farfetched, but it's a possibility.

And I agree with you. Permenant Auto-Life? o.0 Why give it you on the last boss?? That makes no sense!

1) The summoners didn't realise that a new sin is created from the final aeon each time, and that you'd have to sacrifice someone to use as the final aeon. They knew that a Final Aeon stopped Sin for a few years and so they would go in search of this final aeon, without realising that a new final aeon has to be made as the old one is used to create the next Sin.

And I can't explain in much detail the other two. And the last boss was bollocks.

1) The summoners didn't realise that a new sin is created from the final aeon each time, and that you'd have to sacrifice someone to use as the final aeon. They knew that a Final Aeon stopped Sin for a few years and so they would go in search of this final aeon, without realising that a new final aeon has to be made as the old one is used to create the next Sin.

And I can't explain in much detail the other two. And the last boss was bollocks.

Guys, the so-called last boss was nothing more than a symbolic fight meant to wrap things up. If you take offense to that, you also have to take offense to the similar bit at the end of FFVII.

I would call Braska's final aeon the last proper boss of FFX The fight with your aeons and Yu Yevon as more of a cinematic point in the games storyline, also anyone notice that Yu Yevons death is similar to Necrons death from FFIX?

1) It would depend on how many guardians the summoner had, after all, 1 had to be sacrificed, as did the summoner, and as Yuna says on the Mi'ihen Highroad, even for a few years of the Calm, it's worth it. Maybe any other guardians the summoner had felt the same way and refused to tell people the horrible truth?

I just recalled something that Auron said when Rikku asked him if he knew that there was no faith. He said that "If I told you, would it pevend you from coming?"(or something similar). So meybe summoners came to check themselves even if they knew. And they should have expected to find a faith, maybe eveb Braska's fayth.

Btw i agree with Prak and MCP about the last boss

The reason why no knew is because the Final Aeon becomes the New sin And usually the other guradins Die in the process or like Auron attack Yunalesca and get killed. This preventing the truth from being known.

Sin as far as I can tell is the place where the Dream of Zanakard happens he is the Link between the real and dream worlds this one who is in essence like Auron or a Fayth could ride Sin to each side. Tidus was like Auron in essence till he came to the real world and was given a Solid form either through the Fayth or sin.

As for Tidus and Shuyin no one rememebers a person as they perfectly were so even if someone knew Shuyin personally the Shuyin in the dream world wouldn't be perect so that is a possible explanation. I also only think there is Only one world not countless since the goal was to preserve Zanakard as it were before the war not how to stop a 1000 year gone war.

And yeah I agree with Prak the very Last battle was symbolic you can't even die there is an auto-raise effect in play. Found that out once when I was goofing off fighting Bahumat and he Mega-flared me.

Guys, the so-called last boss was nothing more than a symbolic fight meant to wrap things up. If you take offense to that, you also have to take offense to the similar bit at the end of FFVII.

I think the main gripe there is that at least you have Safer-Sephiroth to battle in FFVII, whereas there is no paticularly challenging boss towards the end of FFX.

Jecht was quite difficult, I suppose.

One more thing. How people can breath in the water?:P

That is never explained. My theory is that people of FFX have gills.

1) After Sin is defeated by the final summoning, Yu Yevon summns the final aeon to create a new Sin right? So when Yunalesca used her husband create her last aeonn, Yevon used him to create the new sin. Therefor there was no faith of Yunalesca's husband for other summoners to use. So why everybody in Spira beilives that by going to Zanakard s/he will find the faith to summon the final aeon?

Everybody in Spira doesn't believe because they don't know. They didn't know that the temple and the Maesters had been deceiving them, and even when it was revealed to them, they didn't/couldn't understand. The Final Summoning and the grandeur of the temples were both things that the people in Spira had held on to for so long.

Of course, even if some people did listen, everyone wants to see for themselves in order to truly believe it. Like you mentioned about Auron and Rikku's exchange, people always want to see for themselves, whether we know or not. That's how we know it's real. Why do you think we look into the casket of a dead person? it's not to remember them, because no one wants to remember their loved ones that way, but more to come to grips with what happened. It makes things real.


2) Auron says that he rode Sin and entered Zanakard. The thing is, how Sin managed to enter Zanakard, if Zanakard is just a dream?

I think that because Auron didn't know that Zanarkand was just a dream, it made sense to him to say that he "rode Sin". Because he was already dead, he could be easily transported between Spira and the dream world.


3) The faith tells Tidus that after the war of Zanakard-Bavelle, the few survivors became faith and were dreaming of how Zanakard used to be. If they were dreaming of how the city used to be, they should had been dreaming and how the people used to be. Does this mean that Tidus lived back then and died in the war? This could explain the appearance of that guy who looks like Tidus in FFX-2. The faith may had been dreaming about him, but only in appearance. What im trying to say is that the fayth may dreams of how the people were in Zanakard, but only in appearance. They cant dream of their characters and emotions, which makes the dreams having a difference character of the person they really used to be in Zanakard.

The Fayth didn't dream up individual people, they dreamed up an entire world. That's why people could live and die there, because why would the Fayth knowingly make bad things happen? why would they allow Jecht to be an alcoholic and hurt his family? why would they allow Tidus' mom to die of heartbreak? The Fayth just provided a world and populated it, then left it to run a natural course like real life. Besides, there is no way that those people who willingly became Fayth knew everyone in Zanarkand to be able to reproduce them, not even in appearance like what you said about Tidus and Shuyin. Also, the Fayth mentions that Tidus might be the dream that could end their dreaming and allow them to rest. If they controlled everything in the dream it would mean they could consciously stop dreaming at any time and pull the plug on their little game of "house" like they were putting away toys. This is what I think, at least.


One more thing. How people can breath in the water?:P

I think it said somewhere that blitzers could hold their breath for extended periods of time (when talking about Wakka's skills as a player and also I think someone mentions that Tidus' ability to hold his breath for so long saved him from Sin's toxin). Notice that each half of a blitzball game lasts only five minutes. There are free-divers even in our world that can hold their breath for around 9 minutes.

My views, nothing official, of course, but I've thought this out before, lol. Hope it helps clarify some stuff.

-Leah.

Guys, the so-called last boss was nothing more than a symbolic fight meant to wrap things up. If you take offense to that, you also have to take offense to the similar bit at the end of FFVII.

The last real boss (actually the entire game for that matter) was a joke. If you had The Magus Sisters or Anima at the least, you could've beaten Braska's final aeon in no time at all. FFVII posed a challenge at the end, nothing like FFX.

No, it didn't. I finished FFVII at fairly low levels (40s) with mostly unmastered materia. The entire game was piss easy.

But still, which did you think was the easier one?

There's no way I can pick one. Both of them were so easy that they're an insult to the intelligence of most gamers. I find it astonishing that so many people cannot see that the FF series has long been the poster child for poor design.

The Fayth didn't dream up individual people, they dreamed up an entire world. That's why people could live and die there, because why would the Fayth knowingly make bad things happen? why would they allow Jecht to be an alcoholic and hurt his family? why would they allow Tidus' mom to die of heartbreak? The Fayth just provided a world and populated it, then left it to run a natural course like real life. Besides, there is no way that those people who willingly became Fayth knew everyone in Zanarkand to be able to reproduce them, not even in appearance like what you said about Tidus and Shuyin. Also, the Fayth mentions that Tidus might be the dream that could end their dreaming and allow them to rest. If they controlled everything in the dream it would mean they could consciously stop dreaming at any time and pull the plug on their little game of "house" like they were putting away toys. This is what I think, at least.

The fayth dreamed only of Zanakard because thats the only place he had memories from. This explains why there was no war with Bavelle in the dreamworld. If the fayth dreamed of the entire world, Tidus would at least know Bavelle.
Also the fayth is unable to dream of the people's character. The fayth dreams of how Zanakard used to be, including the people appearance, but not how the people act and think. Well thats what makes sense to me at least :)

1) After Sin is defeated by the final summoning, Yu Yevon summns the final aeon to create a new Sin right? So when Yunalesca used her husband create her last aeonn, Yevon used him to create the new sin. Therefor there was no faith of Yunalesca's husband for other summoners to use. So why everybody in Spira beilives that by going to Zanakard s/he will find the faith to summon the final aeon?
Because that was what Yevon told them. They didn't necessarily say that the final aeon that they're going to get is Yunalesca's husband. They just said the "final aeon". But, summoners do get the final aeon in Zanarkand because that's where Yunalesca's unsent soul will transform one of the guardians to become the fayth for the final aeon.


2) Auron says that he rode Sin and entered Zanakard. The thing is, how Sin managed to enter Zanakard, if Zanakard is just a dream?
Auron was already dead when he went to "Dream Zanarkand". And remember from the final battle, when the party entered Sin, they ended up in a place like Zanarkand. So, this is what I think, "Dream Zanarkand" is inside or somewhere in Sin. Sin is the bridge between Spira and the dream Zanarkand.


3) The faith tells Tidus that after the war of Zanakard-Bavelle, the few survivors became faith and were dreaming of how Zanakard used to be. If they were dreaming of how the city used to be, they should had been dreaming and how the people used to be. Does this mean that Tidus lived back then and died in the war? This could explain the appearance of that guy who looks like Tidus in FFX-2. The faith may had been dreaming about him, but only in appearance. What im trying to say is that the fayth may dreams of how the people were in Zanakard, but only in appearance. They cant dream of their characters and emotions, which makes the dreams having a difference character of the person they really used to be in Zanakard.
This is what I think, they just created Tidus after the guy who looks like him in FFX-2(which is Shuyin). Remember, Shuyin didn't become a fayth and instead, locked himself up in the cave and poisoned the minds of Baralai, Gippal and Nooj. That's what I think anyways.


The final boss was lame btw ;)
I agree. It could have been more interesting without Auto-life.

the final battle when you figth VS your aeons... it gets really complicated some times, when the have 255 eva and can kill you whit only one hit... I thing they made it like that because it's posible that they become too strong and after you kill the final aeon and have to figth whit lots of aeons,,, whitout a save point it can become frustrating. thats why they gave us a Nemesis a ruby an emerald, an omega, and that legendary Penace...

but even with the Aeons having extremely high stats, your party had Auto-Life casted on them at all times so you couldn't lose.

Ruby was an asshole by the way

1) After Sin is defeated by the final summoning, Yu Yevon summns the final aeon to create a new Sin right? So when Yunalesca used her husband create her last aeonn, Yevon used him to create the new sin. Therefor there was no faith of Yunalesca's husband for other summoners to use. So why everybody in Spira beilives that by going to Zanakard s/he will find the faith to summon the final aeon?
Because the people of Spira aren't told the truth. Zanarkand is a holy place that no one visits apart from summoners and guardians, and the only one to return "alive" was Auron (because he didnt say he was actually killed). Yuna is shocked to find out the faith stone is empty, as is everyone else BUT Auron (and Tidus doesnt really give it a shit obviously, not being a Yevonite). Yunalesca turns a guardian into a new faith, so technically they do find the faith to the final aeon, they just dont know the real story to it. There was only a handful of successful Sin defeats and apart from Braska and then Yuna, they probably all had only one guardian. So up untill Braska, no one came out to tell the story.


2) Auron says that he rode Sin and entered Zanakard. The thing is, how Sin managed to enter Zanakard, if Zanakard is just a dream?
Its a dream, but its also a giant Aeon since its summoned by Yu Yevon, its just on a far more massive scale then normal Aeons and it uses the memories of the huge faith to create a city. Chances are the dream city is out in the ocean somewhere, but even if it isnt, Sin would have access to it since its the one summoning it. Also the official timeline has Tidus born around the same time as Yuna, not 1000 years ago, meaning it has to exist somewere.


3) The faith tells Tidus that after the war of Zanakard-Bavelle, the few survivors became faith and were dreaming of how Zanakard used to be. If they were dreaming of how the city used to be, they should had been dreaming and how the people used to be. Does this mean that Tidus lived back then and died in the war? This could explain the appearance of that guy who looks like Tidus in FFX-2. The faith may had been dreaming about him, but only in appearance. What im trying to say is that the fayth may dreams of how the people were in Zanakard, but only in appearance. They cant dream of their characters and emotions, which makes the dreams having a difference character of the person they really used to be in Zanakard.
Tidus did and didnt exist. Shuyin (guy from ffx2) and Tidus look similar and both are star blitzball players but there are a lot of differences, Tidus is the memory of Shuyin, but brought to life by the faith to destroy yu yevon. They probably couldn't make a real Shuyin because technically Shuyin was sitting in that Den of Woe (ffx2 under mushroomrock road) at the time locked inside as a spirit for 1000 years.



I think the main gripe there is that at least you have Safer-Sephiroth to battle in FFVII, whereas there is no paticularly challenging boss towards the end of FFX.
Having to get inside Sin head on before it used its overdrive took me a few resets, to be honest, I kept dying, even with Anima, Bahamut, and grand summon. Jecht was easy enough but there hasnt been a difficult boss fight since FFVIII (because ultimacia was difficult enough in her last form and could take a pounding).

Killing yu yevon was symbollic, they didnt want you to die, just like the way you can't die killing Sephiroth when Cloud faces off against him (if you miss omnislash, he'll counter with a normal attack automatically when sephiroth hits him)

Last night Ive finished the game, and ive got some questions about the plot.
Spoilers


1) After Sin is defeated by the final summoning, Yu Yevon summns the final aeon to create a new Sin right? So when Yunalesca used her husband create her last aeonn, Yevon used him to create the new sin. Therefor there was no faith of Yunalesca's husband for other summoners to use. So why everybody in Spira beilives that by going to Zanakard s/he will find the faith to summon the final aeon?

2) Auron says that he rode Sin and entered Zanakard. The thing is, how Sin managed to enter Zanakard, if Zanakard is just a dream?

3) The faith tells Tidus that after the war of Zanakard-Bavelle, the few survivors became faith and were dreaming of how Zanakard used to be. If they were dreaming of how the city used to be, they should had been dreaming and how the people used to be. Does this mean that Tidus lived back then and died in the war? This could explain the appearance of that guy who looks like Tidus in FFX-2. The faith may had been dreaming about him, but only in appearance. What im trying to say is that the fayth may dreams of how the people were in Zanakard, but only in appearance. They cant dream of their characters and emotions, which makes the dreams having a difference character of the person they really used to be in Zanakard.


The final boss was lame btw ;)

1) Everyone in Spira knows a Guardian must die to bring the "Calm", Tidus was just the odd man out, Yu Yevon would keep mutating The Final Aeon into Sin unless he was beaten w/o a final aeon.

2) Sin is Created by the Final "Aeons" Aeons are Fayths, Fayths are the ones dreaming of Zanarkand. Also Jecht missed his son, so being the fayth that he is, he entered the dream world, Auron must have known that's where he was going and must have followed Jecht, per his request.

3) Yeah I found that weird to, but I think the creation of Shuyin, is just to show how in "spira" history goes through the same spiral. I mean his story s similiar to Tidus's he just goes crazy at the thought of losing his love, and tries to save her at all costs.

I don't know what everyones talking about, BFA was had, but I didn't grind much in FFX.

I thought it was a bit unnecessary for the game to give the player automatic Auto-Life during the final boss fight.


Guys, the so-called last boss was nothing more than a symbolic fight meant to wrap things up. If you take offense to that, you also have to take offense to the similar bit at the end of FFVII.

The only thing is that in FFVII, it was more apparent and obvious that the final fight was only meant to be a cinematic fight (the limit bar filling at the beginning, and the close-ups and improved battle models).
FFX gave the illusion that there was supposed to be an actual fight...
It's just that there wasn't one, as it was just meant to be 'cinematic' and symbolic....

That is never explained. My theory is that people of FFX have gills.
I would say so too. In the spring scene in Macalania Woods Tidus kisses Yuna and they both go underwater, swim around, make out etc. Yuna is not a blitzball player and she can manage to hold her breath for quite some time.
Then there is Rikku, she's not a blitzballer either and she can stay underwater for long periods of time. So I guess they do have gills.

If they do then, why only Wakka, Rkku and Tidus jave access in underwater areas throughout the game?:S

Because the others don't want to go in the water. Messes up their dresses and whatnot.

Gills, pah. If you talk to the Aurochs on the beach when you first arrive in Besaid, they mention running out of breath after a few minutes, hence why they are so frequently beaten comprehensively, though Botta says that Wakka can go for several times longer than the others without a breather.

My theory about Rikku's underwater abilities-well, when you first meet her, she is part of an Al Bhed party searching underwater ruins for treasure. So I guess she has built up an ability to hold her breath over time too.

But still...what about Yuna in the spring scene?
On the other side...who cares?

Did you notice how did they put the team in the Via Purifico prison? The swimming team gets put in the water and the rest in a dungeon. How convenient, really.

But still...what about Yuna in the spring scene?
On the other side...who cares?

Did you notice how did they put the team in the Via Purifico prison? The swimming team gets put in the water and the rest in a dungeon. How convenient, really.

I bet Yuna could hold her breath for a short amount of time too.........

Gills are never mentioned in the story, though it is worth noting that Yuna, Rikku and Paine can play blitzball in FFX-2. Either your gills theory is right or they've been practicing their breathing.

Guys, the so-called last boss was nothing more than a symbolic fight meant to wrap things up. If you take offense to that, you also have to take offense to the similar bit at the end of FFVII.

Come on though, this is Yu Yevon. The guy who created Sin, and keeps creating new Sin's. They could have taken the auto-life off, cinematic experience or not, they should have made it even a slight challenge.

I bet Yuna could hold her breath for a short amount of time too.........

Gills are never mentioned in the story, though it is worth noting that Yuna, Rikku and Paine can play blitzball in FFX-2. Either your gills theory is right or they've been practicing their breathing.

Sorry to dp, but there's a downloadable fmv somewhere which explains how Yuna can breathe underwater in X-2. Basic gist of it is an intro to x-2, yuna has been practicing holding her breath ever since Tidus' disappearance. Not sure where to find the fmv, its online somewhere.

And your point is? The game very clearly stated that Yu Yevon himself is more of a mindless force of nature than a villain.

I am inclined to agree with you about the lack of challenge, but that was something the entire game suffered from. In fact, every one of the PSX/PS2 Final Fantasy games was plagued by the same thing. That was basically done to make the games accessible to newbie gamers who don't even understand the basic concept of games being about gameplay, rather than getting to the end. And yes, I have a chip on my shoulder about that. I hold Squaresoft accountable as a large contributor to the last few years' decline in the industry.

Sorry to dp, but there's a downloadable fmv somewhere which explains how Yuna can breathe underwater in X-2. Basic gist of it is an intro to x-2, yuna has been practicing holding her breath ever since Tidus' disappearance. Not sure where to find the fmv, its online somewhere.

The video is called Eternal Calm and is available here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rh_Z8efB_nE).

Spoilers! this version, while in English, has the "good" ending of the game tacked onto it. Spoilers!.

There is another english version, but it has been edited down. This is the entire video, plus one of X-2's endings.

Hey, Yu Yevon is a mindless force of nature then. That should make him harder to beat than your average villain, not easier. Besides, if they're trying to make it more accessible to newbies, then why have some relatively difficult bosses and then slap this easy one on the the end. You'd have had to fight some hard (depending on how much ur levelled) bosses on the way, so Yu could have at least been the same level of difficulty.

I know it makes no sense, but that is Squaresoft's/Square-Enix's design philosophy. They seem to think that having any kind of challenge at the end of the game would frustrate players or something. It's silly, but they've been doing the same thing for a decade now. If you ask me, they should look at all the vastly superior western games and mimic their gameplay, but I know they're too dumb to try something that sensible.

Shuyin springs to mind as being a difficult FF final boss (not that he was actually that hard, he just wasn't so much easier than vegnagun).

And your point is? The game very clearly stated that Yu Yevon himself is more of a mindless force of nature than a villain.

I am inclined to agree with you about the lack of challenge, but that was something the entire game suffered from. In fact, every one of the PSX/PS2 Final Fantasy games was plagued by the same thing. That was basically done to make the games accessible to newbie gamers who don't even understand the basic concept of games being about gameplay, rather than getting to the end. And yes, I have a chip on my shoulder about that. I hold Squaresoft accountable as a large contributor to the last few years' decline in the industry.

Prak, I'm not entirely sure I agree with you about the percieved lack of difficulty in FFX. I thought it was probably the most challenging FF of the PSX/PS2 era to date (pending on my acquisition of FFXII). There were certainly some difficult battles along the way, most notably with Seymour's various transformations and also Jecht/BFA near the end. The game required a fair bit of training to complete it (well for me anyway), which is not something that can really be said about the others from VI to X-2, with the possible exception of IX.

Also, I agree with the point you made re: newbie gamers, but let's be honest here, the FF series is at the height of its popularity, therefore more new gamers, some of whom will be completely new to the RPG genre, will be buying the games and you can't expect Square to make the early bosses of their games too challenging, as that would be risking putting off new gamers. I suppose there is an argument that doing this would alienate long-term fans of the series, but I've been buying FF games and RPGs for just under a decade now and can't really complain with the concept of a learning curve being put into Square's games. One thing I've always wanted to see added though is a difficulty level option. I can't believe no FF game has that. It would be a significant asset for a game to have IMO.

Prak, I'm not entirely sure I agree with you about the percieved lack of difficulty in FFX. I thought it was probably the most challenging FF of the PSX/PS2 era to date (pending on my acquisition of FFXII).


Are you joking? FFX was the easiest FF of them all.

Are you joking? FFX was the easiest FF of them all.

No I'm not joking, FFX had some far more challenging bosses than FFVII and most certainly X-2, whereas FFVIII's junction system was fundamentally flawed, having 3000 HP before Level 12 sort of makes the challenge of the game obsolete, wouldn't you agree?

VI and IX are more arguable, but IX doesn't really require much training to complete and VI is fairly easy (on the whole) once you have access to Magicite/Espers.

I found Penance hard.

whereas FFVIII's junction system was fundamentally flawed, having 3000 HP before Level 12 sort of makes the challenge of the game obsolete, wouldn't you agree?
.
Yes, but most people that played the game for the first time at level 12 barely knew how to junction nevermind knowing how to get 100 curagas.

Yes, but most people that played the game for the first time at level 12 barely knew how to junction nevermind knowing how to get 100 curagas.

The argument is still very much valid though, the system is fundamentally flawed. I mean it's not difficult at all to get the T-Mag RF ability and five Windmills from around Timber. By refining the above items you can get 100 Tornados which, junctioned or simply utilised in combat basically makes you invincible for that point in the game.

It's not like it's a hidden secret or anything. The game makes the junction system clear through tutorials and explains everything fully. Even a relative newcomer to the series could easily take advantage of it.

Thats what in my opinion was unique with the Junction system. You didnt just put materia into slots and run around getting AP for it or run around in circles trying to get points for your sphere grid, you had to do a bit of mucking around or at the very most be smart with how you used it to the best effect. Infact its one of the reasons I liked the Junction system so much.

Still though I wouldnt say that a newcomer would know much about how to get their hands on decent spells like Tornado that early, most people will stick to drawing what they can and realise their mistakes when they are half way through the game and already at a good standard for winning fights. I know thats how it worked for me at least.

Actually the junction system isn't flawed, the level system is broken. S-E abandoned the level system in FFVIII, which made the need for grinding pointless, and your strength come from juctioning not from leveling up. I think the reason they abandoned the level system was like so many games you had to be a certain level to stand a chance against a boss/ have a certain ability. Not everyone plays videogames at the same rate so the added a 'cruise' feature so to speak.

I found Penance hard.

Well, if you had found him easy, he would've been a pretty pointless optional boss ;-)

Actually the junction system isn't flawed, the level system is broken. S-E abandoned the level system in FFVIII, which made the need for grinding pointless, and your strength come from juctioning not from leveling up. I think the reason they abandoned the level system was like so many games you had to be a certain level to stand a chance against a boss/ have a certain ability. Not everyone plays videogames at the same rate so the added a 'cruise' feature so to speak.

Fair enough points Smarties, but the bottom line is, the game makes it possible for you to win most boss fights very easily by junctioning powerful magic to stats. If the game allows you the oppurtunity, it's flawed.

And they didn't abandon the level system......they just made it pointless!

Which is abandonment by any other name. Also, all FFs make bosses easy, also the boss is only difficult if you use a bad strategy, like adel was difficult until I trained Zell ad irvine and just AP ammo assaulted her. There is no FF I've played where i can say I've never found an effective strategy to make a bad situation work for me.

About the water thing, people it's just a game, if we were to ask for a logical answer for every inexplainable question, then gaming has lost meaning.

As for the storyline, this storyline is a lot less confusing compared to the Chrono series. So just shut it and start guessing how it all works.

I don't know if that was a joke or your an imbecile, but either way you get a laugh.

Also, all FFs make bosses easy,

FFX didn't, imo. I don't know how you could call the likes of Evrae, Seymour Flux, Braska's Final Aeon, plus the battle with Sin where he uses Giga-Graviton, easy battles. Without resorting to fairly significant training (ie just playing the game and not going out of your way to improve), those bosses were very difficult.

As for your other point, of course strategies make bosses easier, but that is the measure of a boss's difficulty. If a boss is simply too difficult to beat without using a thought-out strategy, you can say the game's makers have succeeded in making a tough boss. I didn't really find Adel too difficult by the way, but that may well have been down to the fact that all my characters had maxed HP and near-max Str.

Not a chance are all bosses in FF easy. As far as storyline bosses go I had a lot of trouble with materia keeper in FF7 first time playing it when I was a sprog, and Ultimacia is by no means easy on her last form if she manages to hit you while you're at 1hp, which she does a lot. Without Lionhart that fight takes a long time. And ofcourse, Necron is a cunt, and lets not mention Sin, Evrae, etc.

FFX didn't, imo. I don't know how you could call the likes of Evrae, Seymour Flux, Braska's Final Aeon, plus the battle with Sin where he uses Giga-Graviton, easy battles. Without resorting to fairly significant training (ie just playing the game and not going out of your way to improve), those bosses were very difficult.

As for your other point, of course strategies make bosses easier, but that is the measure of a boss's difficulty. If a boss is simply too difficult to beat without using a thought-out strategy, you can say the game's makers have succeeded in making a tough boss. I didn't really find Adel too difficult by the way, but that may well have been down to the fact that all my characters had maxed HP and near-max Str.

I beat all those fights on the first fight. Evrae, BFA, and Seymour Flux, were easy once you just used hastega, and stockpiled your damage. SF prooved a little more challenging just attack the thing next to him with Wakka/ Lulu, and rikku's items. Keep him occupied so he doesn't use cross cleave. Now the hardest playthrough boss was Spectral Keeper, because keeping everyone out of his range was hard and his beserk tail made it harder. Sin was smple hastega and quick hit, make Wakka Auron and Tidus learn this everything trembles in fear, Or just use the Magus sisters.

As far as Adel, I never used, Irvine on my first playthrough, I mainly GF mashed with Quistis and Zell. Irvine's limit breaks makes Adel easy, Rinoa, being killed with GF summons and, limit Breaks, made the fight hard.

I beat all those fights on the first fight. Evrae, BFA, and Seymour Flux, were easy once you just used hastega, and stockpiled your damage. SF prooved a little more challenging just attack the thing next to him with Wakka/ Lulu, and rikku's items. Keep him occupied so he doesn't use cross cleave. Now the hardest playthrough boss was Spectral Keeper, because keeping everyone out of his range was hard and his beserk tail made it harder. Sin was smple hastega and quick hit, make Wakka Auron and Tidus learn this everything trembles in fear, Or just use the Magus sisters.

As far as Adel, I never used, Irvine on my first playthrough, I mainly GF mashed with Quistis and Zell. Irvine's limit breaks makes Adel easy, Rinoa, being killed with GF summons and, limit Breaks, made the fight hard.

Smarties, those are your own personal circumstances and a perfect example of the point I was trying to prove, ie that you must train harder than normal (ie get Quick Hit on Auron, Wakka and Tidus), or go out of your way (get the Magus Sisters who don't join you unless you do the Remiem sidequest) in order to beat many bosses in FFX. Most people (or the average gamer, if you will) will not have those circumstances at that point in the game, hence my argument. I did not, at least.

I also still disagree on Evrae and Braska's Final Aeon, however without knowing your party's status at the point of fighting those two, I can't really say much there. My guess is you've probably trained more than 'the norm' and therefore I was correct in my assesment of the difficulty of the bosses.

About the battles, just by using the Aeons overdrives you can win easily. Thats how I won Seymour the third time

Seymour Flux was so easy it wasn't even funny - oh wait it was hahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!

Smarties, those are your own personal circumstances and a perfect example of the point I was trying to prove, ie that you must train harder than normal (ie get Quick Hit on Auron, Wakka and Tidus), or go out of your way (get the Magus Sisters who don't join you unless you do the Remiem sidequest) in order to beat many bosses in FFX. Most people (or the average gamer, if you will) will not have those circumstances at that point in the game, hence my argument. I did not, at least.

I also still disagree on Evrae and Braska's Final Aeon, however without knowing your party's status at the point of fighting those two, I can't really say much there. My guess is you've probably trained more than 'the norm' and therefore I was correct in my assesment of the difficulty of the bosses.

I didn't complete the sphere grid like some power whores I know, but I didn't stay weak I trained to the best of my limit before fighting sin, And yes as you may guess everyone is hitting 9,999 not 99,999 as celestial weapons are too hard to bother over.

About the battles, just by using the Aeons overdrives you can win easily. Thats how I won Seymour the third time

Seymour usually banishes your aeons so you only get one shot against him with each one. If you build up their overdrives beforehand in order to succeed, (as I did, incidentally) I'd say that's pretty much the same as training. You prepare prior to battle, basically.


Seymour Flux was so easy it wasn't even funny - oh wait it was hahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!

A lot of people had difficulty beating him first time round. In fact he's probably the one that gets advice requests the most on this site. There have been quite a few threads about him.

They probably didn't level up enough and they probably didn't know that holy water cures zombie stats or that shell reduces the damage of total anihilation, either that or they are noobs.

They probably didn't level up enough and they probably didn't know that holy water cures zombie stats or that shell reduces the damage of total anihilation, either that or they are noobs.

Or, you are just a well above average FF gamer (as most of us are on FF Shrine). Take that as a compliment by the way, but the argument is won by me as the point was that if you have to train beyond the game's natural progression, you have acknowleged on some level that the game is difficult.

I didn't see it as an argument just stating a point I feel is true BTW Ceidwad thank you for the compliment.