Ive been hearin loads of people sayin bad stuff about FF7. Whats wrong with it!?! Its the best game ever and anyone who says otherwise is a fuckin idiot!!!!!!!!111 Also prak sucks!!

:rolleyes:

How many times have we been over this?

Do you really want to be the next?

Sefirot is leik the koolest vilen eva!!!!!!!111

Sefirot is leik the koolest vilen eva!!!!!!!111

And Disney makes good movies :rolleyes: .

Damn right they do. How long did this thread go on for? 15 pages or something?

more. And it was still "alive"

Ive been hearin loads of people sayin bad stuff about FF7. Whats wrong with it!?! Its the best game ever and anyone who says otherwise is a fuckin idiot!!!!!!!!111 Also prak sucks!!
FF7 is the best game in the series.

they needed more monkeys imo

Not again, please. For the love of quiznos, we don't need 10 more pages of garbage that I won't read. (Okay, maybe the 1st page was decent)

FF7 is the best game in the series.

ffix is the best game in the series...
ffx is the best game in the series...
ffvi is the best game in the series...
ffxii is the best game in the series...although still not released...

not all of those games can be the best man

but i'm guessing vii probably made the most money b/c of ppl who just bought it for no reason like mankind

Ive been hearin loads of people sayin bad stuff about FF7. Whats wrong with it!?! Its the best game ever and anyone who says otherwise is a fuckin idiot!!!!!!!!111 Also prak sucks!!

There's nothing wrong with it, but it is suited better for kids. I do like it personally, but I don't make a big thing out of it...

Lol another long FF7 thread thats been resurrected.


Sefirot is leik the koolest vilen eva!!!!!!!111

Lol DW that just doesn't suit you :p

Short answer to thread question:

Play some of the other games (wld recommend either FF6, FF9 or FF10) and the answer will be revealed!

ff7 is a good game, good storyline if u get past the terrible graphics and shit FMV's iz alright but not the best

7 is a great game. It's still one of my faveourites.

I really liked the game myself when i first played it, as it was the first out of the lot that i've ever played.

However since, as a result of playing other of the games and thinking properly about what went into FF7's creation my outlook on it has completely changed.

I think FF9 puts it to absolute shame, as does FF6, from what i've played of both so far. I've found both alot more fun and interesting to play.

6, 7 and 10 are my faveourites.

Plot holes aside, I love FF7. Love the story, characters materia etc..... Not my fave rpg of all time, but i love it.

Best rpg, Chrono Trigger!!!

Chrono Trigger has great art work too- Akira Toriyama, right???

And 7 is great even though sometimes you're confused with the plot line- I guess you're meant to be though.

Chrono Trigger has great art work too- Akira Toriyama, right???

And 7 is great even though sometimes you're confused with the plot line- I guess you're meant to be though.

missnox, you love akira toriyama art work?...

cool, then i guess you should play dragon quest 8 too...

most critics give it 5 out of 5...

missnox, you love akira toriyama art work?...

cool, then i guess you should play dragon quest 8 too...

most critics give it 5 out of 5...

Is that the journey of the cursed king??? Because if so then I love that game!

And yes, Akira Toriyama is great, I just completed my collection of dragonball mangas!!

Nothing to do with the topic folks, take it to PM's if you would.

Bollox. This wasnt meant to be a proper FF7 debate thread. If I did one of them id do it seriously. Ah well......

It's 'bollocks', spell it right you darn fool!

Ive been hearin loads of people sayin bad stuff about FF7. Whats wrong with it!?! Its the best game ever and anyone who says otherwise is a fuckin idiot!!!!!!!!111 Also prak sucks!!

this topic as been brought up loads of time's lol.

they needed more monkeys imo

And Mexicans.

Dammit, people are going to really start posting there opinions on FF7 in this thread which, I think, was set up by Desert Wolf as a joke. Let's see what happens over the next few days.

So long as we get some sensible posters in here doing it then I don't mind lol.

So long as we get some sensible posters in here doing it then I don't mind lol.
Yeah, that's true but my guess is that alot of people will just come in, post something moronic about FF7 being good, and then leave.

Yeah, that's true but my guess is that alot of people will just come in, post something moronic about FF7 being good, and then leave.

Tell me, Nostradamus, what do you see in my future?

So long as we get some sensible posters in here doing it then I don't mind lol.

What are the odds of that happening? lol

Well not all newbies are like that lol. For example both you and Mr Bunniesworth are fairly new to the site but you both post sensibly. ;)

It's 'bollocks', spell it right you darn fool!

every ff game after 9 is garbage.
but FFX is recycle-able garbage
and FFXI is an MMO
btw

Someone was prattling on about the fact that Final Fantasy 7 was too mainstream in its attempt to appeal to a wider audience. I don`t see a problem with that. is it cos most people who play RPG`s are snobs who hate it when people play RPG`s that they don`t deem worthy of them?, I hated RPG`s years and years ago until I played Final Fantasy 7 and loved it. So what if it has become more popular, it just means their is more people to talk about things like this in these forums, oh and I don`t care if this is a resurrected thread.

You don't have to be an idiot just because you don't mean FF7 is the best game in the world -.-
This game is pretty amazing, but It's not my fave:P
My favorite game og all time is OoT, but I don't mean your an idiot if you don't agreed with me.

I personally think FF7 is better than FF6 to all those that say FF6 is the best.
I think its one of those rare cases where graphics actually does make a difference.
And dont say FF7s fmvs were the best, because the in battle graphics where much better, the characters didnt look like bombermen.

So what if it has become more popular, it just means their is more people to talk about things like this in these forums, oh and I don`t care if this is a resurrected thread.

But the thing is (assuming you actually read this), popularity doesn't always equal quality. The current US President won a majority of the popular vote in '04. Few (if any) would call him a great president. Anyway.


I personally think FF7 is better than FF6 to all those that say FF6 is the best.
I think its one of those rare cases where graphics actually does make a difference.
And dont say FF7s fmvs were the best, because the in battle graphics where much better, the characters didnt look like bombermen.

Pray, why do the graphics make such a difference? Is it because FFVII's broken battle/character building system is completely outclassed by FFVI's? Or is it because FFVI's story actually takes a bit of time to develop most of the characters, as opposed to FFVII's convoluted story, full of half-developed characters (with one or two notable exceptions)?

I enjoyed 7 more than 6 because it was 3D.
I can admit it. lol

Graphics whore. sexpot

Love that final boss/bosses in FF6 though. FF7 only had like 3 end bosses.

VI was better.

I personally think FF7 is better than FF6 to all those that say FF6 is the best.
I think its one of those rare cases where graphics actually does make a difference.
And dont say FF7s fmvs were the best, because the in battle graphics where much better, the characters didnt look like bombermen.


This is a case where its an opinion of what u prefer. Crappy 3d gaphics or great 2d graphics? I like better good 2d graphics but u prefer 3d ones ;)

About the FMVs. Didnt get what u mean. That 7's are bad or good?

im noob and ff7 ownd, :)

I would put forth that if you think VII is the best FF, then you fail, plain and simple. The battles were the only thing that kept me going through it; Materia was fun to play with. The story was a bore however, and was nonexistant for the first half of the game.

So, that's what's wrong with VII. Just in case I was supposed to take this seriously. If this is a joke, pie.

Oh my, I was under the influence this was a joke thread:rolleyes:.

Anyways FF7 wasn't bad it could have been way better, but even the best plans have their downfalls.

Graphics: Nonsenscicle bull. All 3d games that came out in FF7 era totally owned FF7s graphics why you might ask? I really don't know, no FF graphics were as bad as 7's, but it was FF first 3d game so much was expected.

Story: Sort of slow to build up but eventually it snowballs, not edge-of-your-seat-OMG type of way, but snowballs into a mediocre story.

Battle System: Nothing new magic summons weapon changes just like any other FF. Materia... the most confusing thing ever not only do you level your magic up but you level up your materia, just so you can use another stronger spell. Not to mention the limitation of the amount of things you may want to be able to do in battle, not only did materia stifle magic growth, but it also stifled certain abilities.

The Characters: Were hollow to me but so were a lot of rpg characters back then, I didn't feel like they cared about anything, just like they were there just because the writers wrote them in there. How can cloud just jump off a bus, fight two random gaurds, meet a mysterious guy, and just cooperate with his demands. That's what I got from it or did I miss something?

Overall I think ff7 was good, it's just that the way people can just throw themselves over a mediocre game and proclaim it the best ever, just baffles me.

it's just that the way people can just throw themselves over a mediocre game and proclaim it the best ever, just baffles me.

that's the most sensible thing you've ever said.

7 is a great game. It's still one of my favourites.

It's aged really badly. Only good games age badly.
However the hype carried it a lot further than it deserved to go.

I can see that 6 pushed the snes much further than 7 pushed the psone.

Maybe it would be fairer to compare 4 to 7, 5 to 8 and 6 to 9, because they were released 1st 2nd and third on their consoles.

FFshrine wars II: Attack of the FF7 fanboy clones

The thing I hated about 7 was that once finaly all-powerful there were no enemies left to fight. Shinra was all out of wonder weapons. There were only 1 or 2 weapon giants left and a world full of wilder beasts. Sad I was with all that power and no one but a surprisingly weak Sephiroth to fight. Big let down..

It's aged really badly. Only good games age badly.
However the hype carried it a lot further than it deserved to go.

I can see that 6 pushed the snes much further than 7 pushed the psone.

Maybe it would be fairer to compare 4 to 7, 5 to 8 and 6 to 9, because they were released 1st 2nd and third on their consoles.

FF7 had the worst grahics and lesss detailed FMVs at its time. Just check games that came out in 97.

FF7 had the worst grahics and lesss detailed FMVs at its time. Just check games that came out in 97.

meh, graphics aren't everything in my eyes...
although yeah, I do kinda agree, it'd be nice if Cloud's head wasn't as big as his torso... >_>

but hey, if graphics were everything, no body would even bother to keep replaying classics anymore... cuz... y'know... compared to today's graphics... it's like... a crystal vs. mud. but although graphics play a role in making a game good or not... it's not everything...

Well for the Ps1 the Graphics was ok, but if it waws on the Ps2 i would expect the graphics to be astonishing.

Well for the Ps1 the Graphics was ok, but if it waws on the Ps2 i would expect the graphics to be astonishing.

Which has exactly what to do with the topic at hand?

meh, graphics aren't everything in my eyes...
although yeah, I do kinda agree, it'd be nice if Cloud's head wasn't as big as his torso... >_>

but hey, if graphics were everything, no body would even bother to keep replaying classics anymore... cuz... y'know... compared to today's graphics... it's like... a crystal vs. mud. but although graphics play a role in making a game good or not... it's not everything...

Yes i know what you mean, i just want to point it because some people say the graphics were perfect for its time :)

Maybe it would be fairer to compare 4 to 7, 5 to 8 and 6 to 9, because they were released 1st 2nd and third on their consoles.

I dont think its a bit fair to compare those games really. 7 > 4 , 5> 8 and as for 9 and 6... well ive played 9 again a while ago and I have to say that its certainly one of the best but so is 6 so 9 = 6.

The thing I hated about 7 was that once finaly all-powerful there were no enemies left to fight. Shinra was all out of wonder weapons. There were only 1 or 2 weapon giants left and a world full of wilder beasts. Sad I was with all that power and no one but a surprisingly weak Sephiroth to fight. Big let down..

ATOM NARMOR THEY NEED A BOSS LIKE PRINCE NAMOR

HP LIKE 3,342,344,100
MP LIKE 1,111,111,111
HE WOULD HAVE THREE ATTACKS THAT DEAL 99,999 DAMAGE TO EVERYBODY ON SCREEN

GOOD BOSS IMO

ATOM NARMOR THEY NEED A BOSS LIKE PRINCE NAMOR

HP LIKE 3,342,344,100
MP LIKE 1,111,111,111
HE WOULD HAVE THREE ATTACKS THAT DEAL 99,999 DAMAGE TO EVERYBODY ON SCREEN

GOOD BOSS IMO

Why dont people with ideas like yours work for square :(

7 > 4

LIEZ!

LIEZ!

OH NOES! ITZ PRAK! Flee my fanboy children!!

lol

also lol.

I don't get that... FF7 isn't bashed. Not at all. If I had to name a most bashed FF, it would be 8 (even though it was a cool game).

I honestly don't know where you got that from. FF7 and FF8 are the best games in the series if you look past FF7's sucky graphics. But I don't know what's worse: FF7's Graphics or Rinoa. But that's not the point. FF7 is considered the best game by many people. Just because one person hates it doesn't mean it's instantly a bad game. Like how just because 1000's buy a game doesn't automatically make it awesome.

I just don't know where you got that idea from...

You certainly haven't been here very long. FFVII gets plenty of bashing. Those of us who are older (and being an older community, the average age is older) generally see the game's faults more clearly than kids, and berate it for them accordingly.

In fact, the concensus among many of the older members is that FFVII and FFVIII were absolutely terrible.

I don't get that... FF7 isn't bashed. Not at all. If I had to name a most bashed FF, it would be 8 (even though it was a cool game).

I honestly don't know where you got that from. FF7 and FF8 are the best games in the series if you look past FF7's sucky graphics. But I don't know what's worse: FF7's Graphics or Rinoa. But that's not the point. FF7 is considered the best game by many people. Just because one person hates it doesn't mean it's instantly a bad game. Like how just because 1000's buy a game doesn't automatically make it awesome.

I just don't know where you got that idea from...

There is a difference between a fact and an opinion. In your opinion ff7 is good game but in facts it has many flows. Prak is right, the game here is criticized a lot (and in some point ending in fights) and ff8 is criticized a lot too. But come on ff8 and ff7 are not the best games in the series! I dont see anything original on them with exception the battle systems (8's sucks).

EVARYBODY

I am ffvii fanboy

see ffvii cool seph is the man i cried when aeris died um what else they say anybody know

but really suikoden ii is better please play that instead everybody

omg sephiroth is the coolest villain ever

he has this really long sword and he could kill u all lol

man honestly suikoden is like the best THING EVAR

#offtopic

ive never played suikoden. Its THAT good?

FFVII and FFVIII were absolutely terrible.

man i wouldn't say absolutely terrible i mean if u compare them to suikoden ii or i or iii or v they are like junk but then again everything is junk to suikoden anything but iv and maybe those japanese suikogaidens i didn't play because man i took four years of japanese and like i know nada so then like u know suikoden is so good anyways man i remember that cloud was like man he had that sword i mean you have to get at least maybe terrible +1 which is more like pretty terrible or something for killing off that whore i mean she is a whore that teaches u a moral lesson u try to sell your body u get messed up i mean it makes perfect sense seph killed aeris because she was u know man u know but then cloud kills seph because u know man sephiroth was trying to summon that meteor or something and said dang i remember when tellah or whoever used meteor if he has not enough mp he is going to die anyways i better go kill him before he has a chance to completely summon it i am guessing it was like final fantasy tactics for that spell with ct you know pretty long ct for meteor because it is the best spell in the game and then holy is like that too maybe you know big charge time but aeris died dang i remember oh wait maybe it is one of those spells where it is used to counter something you know like when opponent casts this we use this man that makes more sense back to the point cloud probably just got mad at seph because u know man he didn't get to ride a ho train like godfather would say and wanted his money back i mean he did pay 1 gil for the flower i mean u know what that really was man and like man u know that was what square meant i mean u can tell by how they made tifa too big u know man that was like man they were just writing one of those stupid romance novels u know man with that stuff that would get it banned from movies and stuff and then they censored it a bit and said final fantasy good name let's go with vii because we had six in japan and then sakaguchi said next time let's make another whore who is rinoa but she didn't die so saying absolutely terrible is fine by me hope you all have a nice day

Woa FF7 is really receiving some major bashing, i would say that ff7 was a good game for its time and is still a classic i would definetly love a remake, but after that the game would be dead.Ive recieved a lot of bashing for promoting FF7 on alot of sites, saying im a fanboy, im a worshipper balh blah blah. But all in all the game is cool and i like it, it was my first rpg and it opened me to world of that particular genre

People seem to forget(or aren't aware) of how heavily advertised FFVII was. Not many games are more mainstream then FFVII.

Now, I don't take as strong a view as Prak or Smokey in regards of thinking its a bad game. I know its flawed, however I still enjoy playing it, and since it was my first rpg, I guess that counts for something. Nostalgia or whatever you want to call it.

I know its flawed, however I still enjoy playing it, and since it was my first rpg, I guess that counts for something. Nostalgia or whatever you want to call it.

Im rubbing off on you bryan. :p

Pish, i've always had that view.

FF7 had the worst grahics and lesss detailed FMVs at its time. Just check games that came out in 97.

You're talking crap. The production values on ff7 are quite obvious.

Ever played fifa 98 (made in 1997) it looks crap. I can't think of many psone games released in 1997.
Also square enix have a cgi studio so how can their fmvs be worse quality than other games?

yes compared to ff8 and ff9 they are the worst. But other games from 1997? nope.

You're talking crap. The production values on ff7 are quite obvious.

Ever played fifa 98 (made in 1997) it looks crap. I can't think of many psone games released in 1997.
Also square enix have a cgi studio so how can their fmvs be worse quality than other games?

yes compared to ff8 and ff9 they are the worst. But other games from 1997? nope.
Square Enix wasn't the only company back then to have a CGI studio, if they did. And there are games that looked better than FFVII. So don't even say that there isn't a single game that doesn't surpass the game with its looks.

I hated FF7 because when you compare it to other games released around its time like Vagrant Story and Tales of Phantasia PSX, the difficulty and challenge is greatly lacking.

i hate pumpkin pie a lie i really like it

I hated FF7 because when you compare it to other games released around its time like Vagrant Story and Tales of Phantasia PSX, the difficulty and challenge is greatly lacking.

Vagrant Story also looks a heck of a lot better, from what little I've played (yes, it's on my wish list, right behind SO2). Also, Tekken 2 was released in August, 1996, and its graphics are easily better than FFVII's.

As for FFVII, my stance has changed since I've played it last. While I no longer think it the worst FF of the series to date, it's by no means better than average.


You're talking crap. The production values on ff7 are quite obvious.

See my Tekken 2 remark above. Also, the production values? Yes, they're quite obvious--just look at the FMV at the end of disc 1, which most fans consider the defining moment of the game. They can't even keep a certain character's attire consistent.

Vagrant story was great ^___^

Vagrant Story also looks a heck of a lot better, from what little I've played (yes, it's on my wish list, right behind SO2). Also, Tekken 2 was released in August, 1996, and its graphics are easily better than FFVII's.

Vagrant Story was released in 2000, 3 years after FFVII. By this point PSX graphics had been heavily refined (eg compare FFVII with FFIX). While it's true that Tekken 2 does look a whole lot nicer than FFVII, this is generally to be expected in fighting games compared to RPGs due to them being far shorter and requiring only a fraction of the character models.

Apart from that, there really isn't much else I can contribute to this discussion. Any flaws I would have pointed out in this game have already been stated here; a few of them multiple times.

While it's true that Tekken 2 does look a whole lot nicer than FFVII, this is generally to be expected in fighting games compared to RPGs due to them being far shorter and requiring only a fraction of the character models.

Andyuk didn't specify any particular genre, ftr. He also made a point about FMV's; Tekken 2's were far better than FFVII's--Tekken 2 had plenty of FMV's, as well. There was the intro FMV, and one "ending" for each of the 20-plus characters.

I missed something. Why are people comparing FF7 to Tekken2? Oh well. I dont wanna know.
I dont see how Tekken having better graphics makes FF7 a bad game.
Lets knock it up a notch. BAM!

Andyuk made the point that FFVII's graphics were apparently so good for '97, when in reality they weren't that great. I pointed out Tekken 2 as a game that came out thirteen months earlier and yet still had superior graphics to disprove his point.

Ok. Then he said something about FF7 having good graphics for an rpg game at the time, right?
And not being comparable to a fighting game.

While it's true that Tekken 2 does look a whole lot nicer than FFVII, this is generally to be expected in fighting games compared to RPGs due to them being far shorter and requiring only a fraction of the character models.

There ya go.

Discussion has gotten more intelligent in this subject area, I must admit.

ff1 man i think ur game is cooler than vii though i must say that vii ain't to bad 4 me u know it was the first ff i played b/c man i was more into platformers u know i have since then to maybe around two years ago been big rpg man but now really more of sports with rpg 2nd and platformers u know like 3rd though it is not as good as legacy of the wizard man i had that game for nes best game ever almost maybe not even in my top ten suikoden is so cool u should b suikodeniiwithouttir or something though that is really simple maybe suikodeniwithoutrunes

got to be said, i'm a huge fan of vii, possibly the most involving plot of all the ones i've played so far (i, ii, iv, and vii through to x-2) the spin offs are a huge indicator of how succesful the game is, and bad games arent successful, i chose gameplay over graffics any day, and 1 night of playing vii round a mates house was enough for me to throw away my mega drive and break the bank to buy a ps1 the next day. of course all of this is my opinion, which i'm not trying to force on anyone or get approval for, just saying.
the only game in the series i had a problem with was ii, and that was because of the fight/point gaining system, nothing else, i think they are all great and vii is my favourite by a long way, but at the same time as i say, i've never touched iii, v, vi, or xi so maybe they will blow my mind when i get to them, but for now i cant see how anyone can say vii was "bad" its the reason most people in this country ever heard of any of the ff series and, as such, can not be slagged off
(in my opinion)

man in my opinion dogs should be president man

i mean a dog as president that is pretty awesome

fact

not just my opinion now

fact

what else um go angels

but really man final fantasy sucks so much suikoden is the stuff i can't get enough of man

suikoden

the water margin

108 stars of destiny

i mean seriously luc was a star
and yuber
and sarah

the bad guys got three stars in iii

man that is deep

b/c man luc was trying to change destiny by destroying the true wind rune because he saw the future from the rune and saw it was bad and tried to defy destiny but man cannot defy destiny or something so he though to destroy the balance in the world by destroying the true wind rune in order to try and give everybody a better future but man the chaos that could bring so then the heros man they stopped luc but really i don't believe luc would've been able to do it you know he wouldn't have done it but he was able to rid himself of the true wind rune and die like he probably wanted you know so maybe it is okay but dang luc was truly a good guy imo i mean he tried to save everybody but failed stupid hugo geddoe chris luc was the man masked bishop dang I WISH HIM THE BEST really i do the best leknaat wasn't really in suikoden iii really i mean not at all i mean look at it she didn't try to stop luc and luc was a star of destiny my take on it is leknaat may have wanted to see if luc could change destiny fate u know she probably knew luc was going to fail but just wanted to see i mean really i know luc said that she had a half rune and it was inferior to the true wind but imo that wouldn't stop leknaat from helping the other true rune bearers like geddoe chris hugo sasari from destroying luc u know so all in all there was chris hugo sasari geddoe luc yuber with true runes i may have forgot one but i don't think so this is for playable characters though i am not talking about the leader of harmonia with circle rune just so you all know

IN MY OPINION

got to be said, i'm a huge fan of vii, possibly the most involving plot of all the ones i've played so far (i, ii, iv, and vii through to x-2) the spin offs are a huge indicator of how succesful the game is, and bad games arent successful, i chose gameplay over graffics any day, and 1 night of playing vii round a mates house was enough for me to throw away my mega drive and break the bank to buy a ps1 the next day. of course all of this is my opinion, which i'm not trying to force on anyone or get approval for, just saying.
the only game in the series i had a problem with was ii, and that was because of the fight/point gaining system, nothing else, i think they are all great and vii is my favourite by a long way, but at the same time as i say, i've never touched iii, v, vi, or xi so maybe they will blow my mind when i get to them, but for now i cant see how anyone can say vii was "bad" its the reason most people in this country ever heard of any of the ff series and, as such, can not be slagged off
(in my opinion)
First off, spin-offs aren't always a huge indicator of how successful a game is. Look at Hollywood today; just about every single movie gets a sequel or two, then five spin-offs, and a director's cut version, etc. The same can be said for video games, especially FFVII. If you want to judge success on how popular the game is, I can't really argue that point (except argue why people blindly think its so popular and great). But a game needs to be of good quality throughout for it to be successful, and FFVII wasn't.

Even with that said, I don't even know why I've bothered with your post. You have yet to play several games of the series, and one of those happens to be an even more popular choice for best game in the series? Puh-lease

got to be said, i'm a huge fan of vii, possibly the most involving plot of all the ones i've played so far (i, ii, iv, and vii through to x-2) the spin offs are a huge indicator of how succesful the game is, and bad games arent successful, i chose gameplay over graffics any day, and 1 night of playing vii round a mates house was enough for me to throw away my mega drive and break the bank to buy a ps1 the next day. of course all of this is my opinion, which i'm not trying to force on anyone or get approval for, just saying.
the only game in the series i had a problem with was ii, and that was because of the fight/point gaining system, nothing else, i think they are all great and vii is my favourite by a long way, but at the same time as i say, i've never touched iii, v, vi, or xi so maybe they will blow my mind when i get to them, but for now i cant see how anyone can say vii was "bad" its the reason most people in this country ever heard of any of the ff series and, as such, can not be slagged off
(in my opinion)

While the Professor beat me to the punch, I've still got to jump on this a bit, seeing as I just got off from work and have a little steam to blow off--My friend Cap'n Morgan's helping with that, too. XD

To sum up your post in a sentence, your point is that those who criticize FFVII shouldn't merely because of its popularity. I say that popularity doesn't (always) equal quality. I've used this example at least a hundred times, but look at the current US President. Just two years ago, he won a majority (as in more than 50%) of the popular vote, which hasn't been done since his dad won the presidency in '88. He's not exactly a great president. Likewise, FFVII, while incredibly popular, really isn't nearly as great as its fans make it out to be.

Remember kids, mainstream doesn't mean it's any good.

You certainly haven't been here very long. FFVII gets plenty of bashing. Those of us who are older (and being an older community, the average age is older) generally see the game's faults more clearly than kids, and berate it for them accordingly.

In fact, the concensus among many of the older members is that FFVII and FFVIII were absolutely terrible.

Well yes, I haven't been here very long... But even if I am an inexperienced douche, I still have my opinions and you all have yours. I'm not asking you to change your opinion to suit me because opinions is what makes us all human. But I just think that FF8 is better than FF7 because with the Junction system, you have to really think about what combinations will work. Instead of FF7's "Here u go Cid you're now a mage" system.

Well yes, I haven't been here very long... But even if I am an inexperienced douche, I still have my opinions and you all have yours. I'm not asking you to change your opinion to suit me because opinions is what makes us all human. But I just think that FF8 is better than FF7 because with the Junction system, you have to really think about what combinations will work. Instead of FF7's "Here u go Cid you're now a mage" system.

What about the "here you go Squall now you're invincible" system?

What about the "here you go Squall now you're invincible" system?

I second that.
9999 HP long before level 50??
Crap.

I love how you guys are arguing over which game is more broken instead of just accepting them both as fatally flawed and moving on like sensible people would do. :laugh:

I can care least which one "failed" the most all I care was I had fun playing them, you guys take games to seriously, or is gaming serious buissness as well?

What LR said really. Games are for fun! Stop analysing them and start playing them!

Ive been hearin loads of people sayin bad stuff about FF7. Whats wrong with it!?! Its the best game ever and anyone who says otherwise is a fuckin idiot!!!!!!!!111 Also prak sucks!!

I agree with this acept the Prak part cause I don't even know him

I've had a really bad day and TBH you really aren't helping matters, however thanks for repeating the very first post in the thread, like we havn't read it already!

I agree with this acept the Prak part cause I don't even know him

That whole post was sarcastic, dumbass. Now you look like an idiotic fanboy and don't even have someone to agree with you.

I agree with this acept the Prak part cause I don't even know him

XP
I think every game has something to enjoy in it, and something to hate in it....
I usually enjoy every game I play... I don't see what's bad about liking a game--though I do think that other people who dislike the game should be allowed to have their opinion too...

I just find it a little unsettling that some people seem to try so hard to find flaws in games and publicize them...
I know that fanboys and fangirls are sometimes a bit annoying--but I also think that trying to take away the enjoyment some people experienced isn't very fair either....

Amen to that.

Oh man, this is getting really tiring.

I found FF7 an excellent game. But I'm really annoyed when some ppl who consider themselves "mature players" mock others.
U say FF7 is a great game and they say to u,nah u are just a fan-kid.
Am I being a short-sighted fankid just because I really like a game u don't??That's so stupid.

Accept that different ppl like different things and close the subject.

The argument is not over whether people should like the game or not. It's over if the game is a good game or not. Of course you are allowed to like the game. But you see...

Those who say the game is rubbish gave several good reasons as to why the game is poor.
Those who say the game is good have yet to really come up with much that does not make them look like an idiot. (except perhaps in a few cases)

I have never been bashed for saying I like ff7 because i gave good reasons why I enjoyed the game. But I also agree that it is not actually as good as most people say.

sadly the majority of posters on these forums with a pro-ff7 attitude are also idiots or at least act that way.

I don't say that is a flawless game but some ppl in here even called it "terrible"!Oh come,on. There are some things I don't like in FF7 but call THIS game "terrible"? They are overdoing it, really.

Posters who hate ff7 are more annoying that the others.IMO at least.

I don't say that is a flawless game but some ppl in here even called it "terrible"!Oh come,on. There are some things I don't like in FF7 but call THIS game "terrible"? They are overdoing it, really.

Posters who hate ff7 are more annoying that the others.IMO at least.
haha, you saying that fanboys of FFVII are less annoying than people who don't like the game.

Why must we be called Fanboys just for liking Final Fantasy VII. If you wanna slate a game, slate IX and X. Final Fantasy X is loaded with emo love stories and IX is a badly balanced game which is only saved by its plot.

You're not a fanboy for liking the game. You're a fanboy for denying the game's faults and bashing other games for moronic reasons in response.

If I sat down with a game and started analysing it as much as you do, I would end up a cynical loser just like you and I haven`t got time for that.

I roffled at that. Silly little moron, you provide me with so much amusement!

Roffled?, internet slang is something thats lost me, maybe you should post your dictionary online so we actually know what your on about. Still raving FF IX`s merits??

I've really got to try IX, second you are only a fanboy when you argue fact with opinion. Saying FFVII is teh best game evers, when it has been proven time and time again, that it isn't.

Especially when he used some uber-generic, baseless gripe about a game that's quite superior to his apparent 'chosen.'

To jump back into my bullshit thread, id like to say that I watched the bonus disc of Advent Children the other day while I was at home sick from school. It was very interesting to watch. It was the creators talking about the movie but it has relevance to the game. They basically said that anything goes in FF7 and in AC.

In regard to the character of Cloud and the fact that he is "weak", they said that Cloud is a very weak person and although he is the hero he is meant to be more human than most heros who are just invincible and stuff, and they hoped that he would inspire other weak men that they can turn out strong in the end.

I have to jump to AC for a sec here to try explain what im saying.

Basically the creators wanted to do something that wasn't done before. They decided that they wouldn't mind the physics in the movie as long as it looked cool. They used camera angles that couldn't be possible in real life too. Rather than making the characters as real looking as in TSW they wanted to keep them in the world of FF7 and said if they wanted them to look real then they would be as well off just shooting the thing. Everything they did was different to what most films would be made like which is why people who were judging it against other films, such as Prak here, thought it was rubbish and complained about stuff like that.

So what im saying is, FF7 is different to most games because of the anything goes attitude of the creators. So what I think is people who look at this game criticaly and judge it off of other games will think its rubbish yet anyone who just plays it and actually follows the story will see that it is a very good game and has no plot holes. Hohoho see what I did there?

If I sat down with a game and started analysing it as much as you do, I would end up a cynical loser just like you and I haven`t got time for that.

This retard here is a shining example of why philosophy, analysis, rationality and "thinking" is a lost art nowadays. Congratulations, you Darwin awards reject, you've just broke the forum record for "most stupid poster" in the year 2006. Your mother must be proud. :rolleyes:

And DW, there's a difference between bending physics to make the action look cooler and completely shitting on physics altogether and being lazy. Also the camera shots make the action almost impossible to follow, also can be attributed to laziness.

Of course, everything the filmmakers say is going to be biased in their own favor and is not going to include the natural and just criticisms of their methods.


Basically the creators wanted to do something that wasn't done before. They decided that they wouldn't mind the physics in the movie as long as it looked cool.

That attitude is generally not acceptable. Being different just for the sake of being different is never sufficient justification.


They used camera angles that couldn't be possible in real life too.

They also didn't stop to think about whether they should. A lot of the shots in the movie were ridiculous, showing nothing relevant at all in a place where a more conventional shot would have conveyed the point better.


Rather than making the characters as real looking as in TSW they wanted to keep them in the world of FF7 and said if they wanted them to look real then they would be as well off just shooting the thing.

Bullshit. They wanted to make it more cheaply. You can tell that because of the hair on the characters. Compare the follicle counts. AC's characters only have a fraction of the hair follicles that TSW's characters had. No matter what style they were going for, that's a dead giveaway.


Everything they did was different to what most films would be made like which is why people who were judging it against other films, such as Prak here, thought it was rubbish and complained about stuff like that.

Paradigms exist for a reason. The established rules of filmmaking do not change simply because someone thinks different is a good idea. The pure fact of the matter is that they ignored the concept of putting the camera where it needs to be to best show the events depicted. Another fact is that they blatantly made heavy use of deus ex machina, which is a severe flaw in storytelling of any form.

And DW, there's a difference between bending physics to make the action look cooler and completely shitting on physics altogether and being lazy. Also the camera shots make the action almost impossible to follow, also can be attributed to laziness.

So the creator comes along and gives their reasons for the camera angles and the physics and you just say its just laziness. You have to be right, sure what would they know :rolleyes:

@ Prak: Why do you always post when i do? I shall watch the DVD again and reply to this in a while. Dinner and homework calls!

I say it's a cop-out excuse. :P

I`m just saying that somethin isn`t bad just cos Prak said it is 6000 times.

Of course something isn't bad just because I say it is, but I only say things are bad because they are, so it's a moot point.

I`m just saying that somethin isn`t bad just cos Prak said it is 6000 times.
I've said it's bad 6,000 times as well. The fact of the matter is this; more people have claimed FFVII is so excellent and should be on a pedestal much higher than just about every other game in existence, but have provided <B>nothing</B> in terms of viable reasons why it is a quality game.

it does have monkey in it i believe +1 for it if it does

I`m just saying that somethin isn`t bad just cos Prak said it is 6000 times.

And something isn't good cos advertisements, moronic critics say so, jftr.

Of course, everything the filmmakers say is going to be biased in their own favor and is not going to include the natural and just criticisms of their methods.

If possible i would advise watching that bonus disc and let you make up you're own mind from that.


That attitude is generally not acceptable. Being different just for the sake of being different is never sufficient justification.

Being a fantasy style movie they don't have to give a damn about the physics anyway.


They also didn't stop to think about whether they should. A lot of the shots in the movie were ridiculous, showing nothing relevant at all in a place where a more conventional shot would have conveyed the point better.

We've been through this before actually and I recall proving you wrong(With help from Giga Flare). Why not point me to a few scenes where you think this is true?


Bullshit. They wanted to make it more cheaply. You can tell that because of the hair on the characters. Compare the follicle counts. AC's characters only have a fraction of the hair follicles that TSW's characters had. No matter what style they were going for, that's a dead giveaway.

They wanted to keep the characters looking like they did in the game somewhat. If Mr.T played Barret then I think the film may have been very different... You know I havent a clue what follicle counts are but perhaps you could enlighten me and show me an example of the follicle counts in TSW and AC.


Paradigms exist for a reason. The established rules of filmmaking do not change simply because someone thinks different is a good idea. The pure fact of the matter is that they ignored the concept of putting the camera where it needs to be to best show the events depicted. Another fact is that they blatantly made heavy use of deus ex machina, which is a severe flaw in storytelling of any form.

Once again im not familiar with the established rules of filmmaking but perhaps you could show me a site or something that would make them clear to me. Surely you must have found these rules somewhere or did you make the rules yourself?

If possible i would advise watching that bonus disc and let you make up you're own mind from that.

Not gonna happen. That would involve paying money for it since I don't know anyone who owns it, and I'm not paying money for it.


Being a fantasy style movie they don't have to give a damn about the physics anyway.

I never said they should keep the physics realistic. My problem is that they don't keep them consistent. The rules of physics change from scene to scene depending on the whims of the director and what he thinks would look cool at a given moment.


We've been through this before actually and I recall proving you wrong(With help from Giga Flare). Why not point me to a few scenes where you think this is true?

As I recall, you were never able to counter this point. However, as an example, I'd point out to you the single instance of this that I remember somewhat clearly. If I'm not mistaken, the location is called the forgotten capital or something like that. Cloud was fighting with one of the silver haired guys and one of them (Cloud or the other guy) jumps at the other and it shows an extreme close-up of the landing and the scuffle afterwards. Then, a moment later, one of them is flung away. You cannot make out any of what happened because it was simply a blur of black-on-black motion. Therefore, the entire shot was a waste of time. It failed miserably to depict the actions it was supposed to be showing.

I noted several other instances of similar failures at key moments, but cannot remember them clearly enough now to debate them.


They wanted to keep the characters looking like they did in the game somewhat. If Mr.T played Barret then I think the film may have been very different... You know I havent a clue what follicle counts are but perhaps you could enlighten me and show me an example of the follicle counts in TSW and AC.

Follicle count refers to the amount of individual hairs each character has. In TSW, the average follicle count was roughly half of the human norm, which was very impressive for CG characters. The AC characters only had roughly 1/30 to 1/40 of the human norm. This is a factor that does not contribute to making it look like the game (unless you think they were trying to make Cloud look like his hair was made of plastic), so it demonstrates a lack of effort.


Once again im not familiar with the established rules of filmmaking but perhaps you could show me a site or something that would make them clear to me. Surely you must have found these rules somewhere or did you make the rules yourself?

You will not find a clear definition of them outside of a film school or a discussion with an experienced (not to mention skilled) director, I'm afraid. However, the basic gist of the paradigms of proper filming is that the camera should always show exactly what the viewer needs to see in order to fully understand what they're looking at. The only exceptions are for shots that are intentionally meant to deceive viewers. That's why rapid cuts and strange camera angles are typically detrimental.

What they mean by low follicle counts is that the hair strands weren't individually animated--they were animated in like..."clumps" of hair....
The Spirits Within animated each hair strand more individually than FFVII: AC did...
Mm, but I still think it was a wonderful work of art, and I can enjoy it....
It's the same way I feel about FFVII....


I've said it's bad 6,000 times as well. The fact of the matter is this; more people have claimed FFVII is so excellent and should be on a pedestal much higher than just about every other game in existence, but have provided nothing in terms of viable reasons why it is a quality game.

It's like both our sides are looking at a painting...
You're saying, "Can't you see the flaws? They're all over the place!"
And the others are saying, "But its cool!" (>> Before you say anything, I left out the apostrophe on purpose)
And then you guys repeat the same thing over and over....

I see FFVII's flaws, but I still think it's beautiful, even with its flaws....
I'm sure you guys won't say that the game isn't ground-breaking, right...?

There's a very large following to this game, too--there are other games just as 'crappy and simple-minded' as FFVII, but they don't have as large of a following....

So there must be something in FFVII...
And I think it's something wonderful...! FFVII is about hope more than anything else...about seeing something repulsive, disgusting, ...seeing horrible flaws in the world around you...and still retaining hope....
If you think that sort of thinking is reckless and stupid, pointless and just poising yourself for disappointment, maybe you wouldn't like FFVII...
And if you think that way...then that means you've once hoped before and it was disastrous.
....
Even so....
Don't be afraid to hope again!
It might not be the safest thing to do, of course, but giving up hope will leave you stuck....You be able to go anywhere anymore....
Have confidence! Don't be so doubtful of yourself....

Of course I'll say that the game isn't ground-breaking. The only thing even remotely ground-breaking about it was its marketing blitz. It became so popular because when the ads aired, it showed all the FMV scenes, making people excited about seeing a game that wasn't all pixelly (I know that isn't a legitimate word). People who had never played games before and had no clue what gaming is even about bought Playstations, and the rest is history.

Also, the rest of that post was total bullshit.

I'm sorry....
I wasn't trying to be offensive to you....

But I really do think FF7 was ground-breaking...! It was what brought RPGs to the forefront, like you've said.
What's not ground breaking about that...?

I'm sorry....
I wasn't trying to be offensive to you....

But I really do think FF7 was ground-breaking...! It was what brought RPGs to the forefront, like you've said.
What's not ground breaking about that...?

The advertising and marketing did.

A game succeeding because it was marketed heavily is not the same thing as a game succeeding because it actually has merit. Frankly, if not for all the people who were new to gaming at the time playing it, the game would be almost universally regarded as the black sheep of its franchise--a status only FFVIII could contest it for.

I see FFVII's flaws, but I still think it's beautiful, even with its flaws....

A game succeeding because it was marketed heavily is not the same thing as a game succeeding because it actually has merit. Frankly, if not for all the people who were new to gaming at the time playing it, the game would be almost universally regarded as the black sheep of its franchise--a status only FFVIII could contest it for.

I've never personally seen any of the marketing for it myself (I was too young), so I can't argue that that's the reason that I got it.
My father was an RPG collector, and FFVII was just another one of the games he got....

Maybe its massive success in marketing IS why FFVII is thought of as "ground-breaking".... maybe its marketing is the reason it was a success....
There's no way to prove that it wouldn't have been successful if it wasn't marketed, anyway.... ><

Do you think it would have been as successful if it wasn't marketed as well?

Short answer, no. If FF7 wasn;t that shamelessly plugged when it came out, it would have been forgotten and the fandom would have pretended it never existed.

Hm.
I see....

Was FFVI well-marketed? (I'm not sure of the details)
Since I wouldn't say people pretend it doesn't exist.

There isn't a single Final Fantasy that we pretend doesn't exist.

FFVII would just receive a lot less love, and a lot less hate if it hadn't been marketed so well.

FF6 was poorly marketted, because it's the shitty remake of FF3 US for the SNES...and, as much as the original SNES release was marketted, it doesn't compare to the sheer publicity FF7 had.

The advertising and marketing did.

That's just not true.

I've met a lot of FF7 lovers in my country and there was not a single advertisement back then,not even now.
I loved FF7 since the first time I played it and I realised that it was so popular only after I started surfing on the Internet(almost 4 years after I played and loved the game). There I was very pleased to know that there are a lot of ppl like me. :P

Well, I do have to say that I am so bored to death of FFVII and have moved on ages ago. As a matter of fact, I've played FFVI more times than FFVII and still play it from time to time, even today.

That's just not true.

I've met a lot of FF7 lovers in my country and there was not a single advertisement back then,not even now.
I loved FF7 since the first time I played it and I realised that it was so popular only after I started surfing on the Internet(almost 4 years after I played and loved the game). There I was very pleased to know that there are a lot of ppl like me. :P

It's an indirect result of advertising, since it's pushed so much, lots of copies of the game were printed, and thus affected the choice when choosing a PSX game when the stores are filled to the brim with copies of the game.

You can`t call a game bad just cos it was marketed well. Star Wars was marketed well and people still liked that.

Read the posts carefully, dipshit. I never said that the game is bad because it's marketed well, I'm saying that it got a lot more publicity when compared to more well-deserving titles like FF4/6 and 9 and thus makes the game much more disproportionately popular.

That's just not true.

I've met a lot of FF7 lovers in my country and there was not a single advertisement back then,not even now.

Calling bullshit on that.

Calling bullshit on that.

I guess "politeness" is a word with no meaning to u.

Fuck up. Whilst I remember FFVII kindly, I do accept that it was deeply flawed and that a large part of my fondness from the game stems from nostalgia. And darkiss, you need to earn your respect here

EDIT: none of this ''u'' balls here please, it's infuriating to read.

I do agree. Spelling shortcuts are for IMs and texting, not forum posts as Joan-Michelle specified in another thread.

I guess "politeness" is a word with no meaning to u.

Try backing up your statements, and if you're gonna defend the game, thats what you need to do. Also, I wasn't rude at all, in comparison to a lot of people.

Try backing up your statements, and if you're gonna defend the game, thats what you need to do. Also, I wasn't rude at all, in comparison to a lot of people.


I'm tired of defending the game. At least to me, u have not good enough reasons to call it mediocre.Most of u were fans of this game and after a while started finding flaws. Or compare it with other ff games. That's just wrong to me. U must judge something according to it's time frame.Yes, the game back then was ground shaking.Maybe now it is not. But it was. The majority of ppl, PSX magazines admit this. Most ppl started being RPG players after playing FF7.
And that "marketing and advertising" sounds very strange to me. In my country ps games aren't being advertised. Not now, not never.
I bought the game because I saw it was an RPG and had 3 CDs.The longer the game, the better. First game I've ever played on PSX. Since then I've played a lot of games. But no game after this gave me the sensation FF7 gave me.

And believe me,most ppl in this forum are rude. Extremely cynical AND rude.

U must judge something according to it's time frame.Yes, the game back then was ground shaking.Maybe now it is not. But it was.

This has been disproven so many times. It's not even funny anymore.


And believe me,most ppl in this forum are rude. Extremely cynical AND rude.

That's the whole allure of being a member.

And believe me,most ppl in this forum are rude. Extremely cynical AND rude.

>< Yeah...I agree....=(
I don't know why they have to be so cynical, though...! They just see things differently than some people, and find flaws where they believe other people haven't....
There's nothing wrong with having a viewpoint that might be seen as upsetting or depressing to others or anything like that. Just be mindful of how your viewpoints may affect others...!
Mm, if you want to share an opinion that you know will be upsetting to others, it's not my place to step in your way and tell you that you can't....
Because I think you should be allowed to share those sorts of things! Those things can be burdensome if you just keep them to yourself.
Of course, it's also not your place to tell another that they have no right to be upset--especially if you shared your opinion knowing that it would be upsetting....

If you didn't know it would be upsetting, then it's alright--I think it's important to realize that it was and apologize if you want to....
But I think if you didn't know it would be upsetting to others, you wouldn't be using a cynical tone in the first place....

EDIT:
That's the whole allure of being a member.
....?
Am I reading that right...?
(Do you mean that you are cynical and rude so that people will sign up to say things...? ....>>
Because that's like....TOTALLY what I did.)

EDIT:
....?
Am I reading that right...?
(Do you mean that you are cynical and rude so that people will sign up to say things...? ....>>
Because that's like....TOTALLY what I did.)

No, I'm cynical and rude, because it is deserved, and because it's allowed. We'd all be banned on any other Forum before you could say "hardass."

Try backing up your statements, and if you're gonna defend the game, thats what you need to do. Also, I wasn't rude at all, in comparison to a lot of people.


I'm tired of defending the game. At least to me, you have not good enough reasons to call it mediocre.Most of you were fans of this game and after a while started finding flaws. Or compare it with other ff games. That's just wrong to me. You must judge something according to it's time frame.Yes,I truly believe that the game back then was ground shaking.Maybe now it is not. But it was. The majority of people, PSX magazines admit this. Most people started being RPG players after playing FF7.
And that "marketing and advertising" sounds very strange to me. In my country ps games aren't being advertised. Not now, not never. And no, I've never seen so many copies in a store. Even if this were happening is just not reason enough to say that advertisements made the game popular.
I bought the game because I saw it was an RPG and had 3 CDs.The longer the game, the better. First game I've ever played on PSX. Since then I've played a lot of games. But no game after this gave me the sensation FF7 gave me. I can't explain clearly this. I feel about it a mix of nostalgia and admiration...Something like this. It touched me. Yes, that's a proper explanation. Not many games are able to do something like this. And no, it had little to do with the characters, if Prak has anything to protest(and I'm sure he has.)



And darkiss, you need to earn your respect here

And you know something? I demand respect. Or at least I believe that people must be polite when they answer. Only because I had expressed a different opinion I had been called "cunt" and "retarded". Is that sane? I was taught to respect people when they something different and try to understand them.

And believe me,most people in this forum are rude. Extremely cynical AND rude.

Demanding respect won't do shit here. And just so you know, all of the reasons you gave make little or no sense.

This has been disproven so many times. It's not even funny anymore.

Sorry pal, but in my college studies it's the first thing I've been taught. "Always judge something according to it's time frame."

And maybe these reasons aren't good enough for you as your reasons for callling this game mediocre aren't good enough for me.

All I know for sure is that there are a lot of people who perfectly understand what am I saying.

And just so you know, all of the reasons you gave make little or no sense.

There isn't a single thing that people say that "doesn't make sense"--everything has a logical process, or an explanation...
Even people who are in asylums have a reason for thinking the way they do, and can make sense....
All it takes is some effort to try to make sense of them....

I think time isn't something everyone has, though....but it doesn't hurt, once in a while, to listen....

The only reason it's difficult to listen to people who are rude and cynical is because it's often the case that they won't listen back....
><
But it doesn't hurt once in a while, too, to listen to the cynical and rude people...because they usually have something that they really do want to say, even behind the cynicism and rudeness....

I'm tired of defending the game.

Tired of failing miserably you mean? Also, if you're tired of doing it, that suggests you do it a lot. Not as many die-hard fans as you made out is there?




At least to me, u have not good enough reasons to call it mediocre.

Have you not read one word of what people who think it's a mediocre game have said? This whole hands in ears, im not listening bullshit is exactly why the fans of this game get a bad name. There are many people here, who like the game, conceed it is flawed, but still enjoy it on a personal level(me being one).


Most of u were fans of this game and after a while started finding flaws. Or compare it with other ff games. That's just wrong to me.

It's 'you' not 'u'. Also, what the fuck is wrong with looking at something objectively. Nothing.


U must judge something according to it's time frame.Yes, the game back then was ground shaking.Maybe now it is not. But it was. The majority of ppl, PSX magazines admit this. Most ppl started being RPG players after playing FF7.

Inane rubbish.



And that "marketing and advertising" sounds very strange to me. In my country ps games aren't being advertised. Not now, not never.

And this.....



I bought the game because I saw it was an RPG and had 3 CDs.The longer the game, the better. First game I've ever played on PSX. Since then I've played a lot of games. But no game after this gave me the sensation FF7 gave me.

That's fair enough, no-one has a problem with that. You aren't understanding however, that personal taste and quality are two entirely different things.


And believe me,most ppl in this forum are rude. Extremely cynical AND rude.

Oh look, ff7 fanboy can't handle people challenging his opinions, we've never seen that before. :rolleyes:

Why you keep calling me a fanboy?
At least call me a fangirl...

There are a lot of die-hard fans here. I don't know if you have noticed, but it's the most active forum of all the other ffs.
I may fail persuade you that this game isn't as bad as you say. But you fail to persuade me that it is.
I understand that quality and personal taste are 2 differenent things. In such arguments it's pretty obvious. I'm just saying that ff7 "haters" overdo it.Calling it "mediocre" and "terrible" are just too much in my opinion. Just say it is not as good as most people say. The game has flaws and I can freely talk about them. But they don't keep me from enjoying and loving this game.
And aren't good enough to call it"terrible".
Inane rubbish? Sorry, isn't you who said that the game became popular because of advertising? I just said that I am not a victim of the advertisements. Such as all ff7 fans in my country.And believe me there are a lot.

Oh, and something else. I've never made a thread saying "Oh, FF7 is perfect, the most perfect game ever." Instead I see a lot of threads bashing on FF7, it is bad because this, it is bad because that. Too much involvement for a "mediocre" game, don't you think? If you don't like it, just say it once and stop there...

And believe me,most ppl in this forum are rude. Extremely cynical AND rude.

Oh look, ff7 fanboy can't handle people challenging his opinions, we've never seen that before.

>>
<<
Umm....Do you think you aren't being cynical or rude....?
Sorry...but...>< That's a bit too much....

>>
<<
Umm....Do you think you aren't being cynical or rude....?
Sorry...but...>< That's a bit too much....


Most people here are both cynical and rude. But after a while you don't care much.

Yeah....
But I do hope they at least notice they're cynical and rude...
Or else the problem wasn't what I thought it was at first....

What the fuck is with all this vitriolic fanboy dribble?

What the fuck is with all this vitriolic fanboy dribble?

I do not know. You tell me.

Darkiss likes men.....





with long hair.

everybody seriously final fantasy vii is what people call the shi someting u know bad word but it means it is good

too much coffee ice cream

suikoden v = suikoden II > suikoden II > suikoden I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> final fantasy anything > suikoden iv

;668454']Darkiss likes men.....





with long hair.

Sephiroth and Vincent no doubt lol.

I demand respect.

I roffled. Fuck off, you stupid cunt.

I roffled. Fuck off, you stupid cunt.

In the Kingdom of Rude-Idiots you would be the King, Prak.

Feel sorry for you.

haha the stupid cunt called me an idiot.

In the Kingdom of Rude-Idiots you would be the King, Prak.

Feel sorry for you.

Wow great comeback...NOT fucktard don't even fight you already lost

man though r u appointing him king b/c u think he can bring order to idiot-ville because he can't i think the working class is all like communism but then the farmer people are like no we are not willing to give up our lunch meat sandwiched go die communism and then the leader of the liberation army is where do i side the farmers have the food but the people have the well nothing die communism and the liberation army and farmer people win

The game has flaws and I can freely talk about them. But they don't keep me from enjoying and loving this game.

If you truly believe the game has flaws, why do you get so uptight when people call it mediocre, when its flaws are what make it so? If you truly understood the difference between actual quality and personal taste, then you would acknowledge that the game isn't really that great, but that's okay because you absolutely love it.


Yes,I truly believe that the game back then was ground shaking.Maybe now it is not. But it was. The majority of people, PSX magazines admit this. Most people started being RPG players after playing FF7.

Except for the minor fact that it isn't groundbreaking. There have been rpg's before, there have been rpg's since. There were 3-d games before FFVII, and games with better FMVs, even a year before its release. So what's so groundbreaking about it? Its popularity? You can deny how it was advertised, but the fact is, it really was advertised like no other game, at least until GTA3. At any rate, you know that "best game ever" line that's displayed so prominently upon the back cover of FFVII? GameFan magazine, the magazine responsible for that line, was more or less a front for a chain of gaming stores in California. I posted an article about that in another thread. Other members have also given anecdotal evidence of reviewers being more or less bribed to give games positive reviews.

If you truly believe the game has flaws, why do you get so uptight when people call it mediocre, when its flaws are what make it so? If you truly understood the difference between actual quality and personal taste, then you would acknowledge that the game isn't really that great, but that's okay because you absolutely love it.





Except for the minor fact that it isn't groundbreaking. There have been rpg's before, there have been rpg's since. There were 3-d games before FFVII, and games with better FMVs, even a year before its release. So what's so groundbreaking about it? Its popularity? You can deny how it was advertised, but the fact is, it really was advertised like no other game, at least until GTA3. At any rate, you know that "best game ever" line that's displayed so prominently upon the back cover of FFVII? GameFan magazine, the magazine responsible for that line, was more or less a front for a chain of gaming stores in California. I posted an article about that in another thread. Other members have also given anecdotal evidence of reviewers being more or less bribed to give games positive reviews.

Because "mediocre"is a pretty strong negative word. I think it deserves something better. Oh, and also I've different opinion about what is flaw and what is not.

I never said that is the "best game ever". That would be a lie. There are better games nowdays but they just did not give the sensation this game gave me. I did not know that the game was so popular until I started reading magazines or surfing the Internet. And this was a long time after I played and loved it.

I'd like to see the article you are saying...Remember where is it?

The word "Mediocre" a pretty strong negative word? What cunting bullshit! I'd class it as a neutral word.

Definition:

Mediocre
Average in quality.

Mediocre is not a strong word at all. You say you know of the flaws of the game, yet you're having a coronary ever time someone challenges you on it. :rolleyes:

Let her have a coronary. That would do us all a bit of good.

Now you are saying...how it was?Oh right. "cunting bullshit".

Uhh, what?

WHAT exactly are you guys fighting about?
Is it the game, or is it pride?

Or is it just for fun...?

The reason someone would get uptight over the word "mediocre" is because you laugh at people and then say it, or use sarcasm with it, as if it were an insult.....
And I think what Darkiss meant by the last post was that the post above theirs is "cunting bullshit".
I think wishing people would have a corollary is kind of...um....bullshit too....>>

Or is it just for fun...?

This is the correct answer.

>>
I was afraid that was the answer....
But it's always the answer, for guys with attitudes like yours...!

Hmf. :o
There are better ways at having fun! You don't have to take it this way--...
You DO realize that you are getting fun at the cost of another person's happiness, right?
Though it might be gratifying at the moment, and may help your ego (if you go that way), you don't have to do it this way! Too much of this will make more people like yourself...and when there are too many people who enjoy taking happiness from others at the other person's cost, all of you will exhaust your own "fodder".

Masturbating is fun, doesn't mean that it's quality entertainment. :P

>>
I was afraid that was the answer....
But it's always the answer, for guys with attitudes like yours...!

Hmf. :o
There are better ways at having fun! You don't have to take it this way--...
You DO realize that you are getting fun at the cost of another person's happiness, right?
Though it might be gratifying at the moment, and may help your ego (if you go that way), you don't have to do it this way! Too much of this will make more people like yourself...and when there are too many people who enjoy taking happiness from others at the other person's cost, all of you will exhaust your own "fodder".

Hahahaha, and people that know me think I'M sensitive. Dear me....

WHAT exactly are you guys fighting about?
Is it the game, or is it pride?

Or is it just for fun...?

The reason someone would get uptight over the word "mediocre" is because you laugh at people and then say it, or use sarcasm with it, as if it were an insult.....
And I think what Darkiss meant by the last post was that the post above theirs is "cunting bullshit".
I think wishing people would have a corollary is kind of...um....bullshit too....>>


Hey, NorseFTX got it right.

Well I guess this is my last post in this thread, because it got pointless to continue. Although I cannot understand why most ff7"haters" in here try to convince others that they are right. To me the game had quality but I guess it's what every human regards something as "quality".And I'm not uptight only because you said that the game is mediocre and terrible. Mostly because I say something else and I've been called cunt,stupid,hilarious,I'm saying bullshit and so on.
I don't understand why you call me "uptight" while you are the ones who swear like troopers. i remained calm, trying to express my opinion and support it with case by my experiance.
Different people, different minds, different opinions, I guess.

That's all for today folks!

Masturbating is fun, doesn't mean that it's quality entertainment. :P

Thanks, Darkiss....=]


Masturbating is fun, doesn't mean that it's quality entertainment. :P

........
...>>

...I suppose...masturbating IS an alternative...but that wasn't the kind I was thinking of.....XP

I meant like...you know...the kind where you worked for sometime on something, and then at the end, you created something that everyone and yourself can be proud of....and then you're happy because of that.....
Mmm! The "Joy of Creation"

I think you guys are enjoying the "Joy of Destruction" right now, which ...I understand, would be fun sometimes....
Just don't overdo it...! >>

Although I cannot understand why most ff7"haters" in here try to convince others that they are right.

Maybe if you actually listened to what some of these 'haters' were saying you might learn something! It's been proven time and time again that the people who think it's a mediocre game have come up with far, far stronger arguements then those that love it. I've said it before, and i'll say it again, I DON'T hate the game, not one bit. I know it's flawed, very flawed, but I still enjoy it.



To me the game had quality but I guess it's what every human regards something as "quality".

What does that even mean? Quality is quality. It doesn't have a different definition in different parts of the world. And when you've been called on this 'quality' you haven't been able to back yourself up.



And I'm not uptight only because you said that the game is mediocre and terrible. Mostly because I say something else and I've been called cunt,stupid,hilarious,I'm saying bullshit and so on.

Of course you're going to be mocked if you can't back yourself up.

Also, FFS SERIOUS BUSINESS. :rolleyes:


I don't understand why you call me "uptight" while you are the ones who swear like troopers. i remained calm, trying to express my opinion and support it with case by my experiance.

Yes, i'm literally tearing whats left on my hair out. Literally.........:rolleyes:

I thought this game was rubbish. I thought it was kinda boring.

Mm....
I think I understand....
This game could be seen as boring by a lot of people...><
>> But I liked it!


What does that even mean? Quality is quality. It doesn't have a different definition in different parts of the world. And when you've been called on this 'quality' you haven't been able to back yourself up.

I think....
Since you guys have seen people who've loved FF7 and called it the best many times, and you've seen them refute logic many times too...and this happens countless times, not just in isolated cases.....that there's a problem outside of the debate of 'quality'.
I said this in another topic, but I think I'll bring it up here, too, since I think it might be relevant...

I think people enjoying FF7 and thinking it as one of the best games ever isn't based on logic...but it's based on an affection that was born when they first played the game. It's just a sort of love for the game...and it's somewhat unexplainable, since it's not based on logic....
I'd think arguing against it with logic is a bit off of the path...you're attacking it with something that isn't relevant--the reason they'd say "FF7's the best game ever" isn't based on logic...it's based on love.

That's why people never have a solid, logical retort, and to you, seem to be "made fools of".

But "Logic" is only one kind of reason. There are others, too. I can't refute...the fact that "Love" is one of the reasons people do things, too.
When you attack someone's love for a game with logic, you're reprising against them and their "ignorant views" with weapons that they never bore against you in the first place.

talk about the game now, why do you like it?

personally i did like it when i first played it, because of the size and scale and the music, it was just the kind of game i enjoyed
(but never played much due to being a megadrive owning european)

and the amount of things you can do before fighting sephiroth was fantastic at the time.

it's aged horribly and i can now see that it has many flaws.

bad translation,
low polygon models (even compared to ff8 and ff9)
a weak battle system (materia makes life way too easy)
it's too easy.

um...

oh and the story isn't all that great, where it should be.

It was great for its time, I agree...
I see its flaws too...

I don't think I'm about to abandon it just because I see new things, though....

Don't think of FF7 itself as becoming "Worse"...it wasn't "Aging horribly, flaws becoming apparent", since it's not changing!
Think that things in general are becoming better!
And FF7 was another part of that path to better-ness, as all games, in some way, were...=]

I've always thought it's important to respect the origin of things. (Don't dwell on them, of course...! But don't toss them aside, either!)

Oh my!I promised not to aswer but I just can't hold on anymore.

Ok...For the last time. I loved the game because of the feeling it gave me. And it's the only game that I've been playing for 9 years and I still love it. It still attracts me. The CD discs have became as soft as butter from playing.

These are the flaws of the game imo:

1)Too easy sometimes. Well, most of the times. One or two levels more from the standar and no enemy could be a threat to you anymore.On top level you are invincible.
2)The graphics could be a lot better.
3)i liked the materia bettle system. But nowdays I prefer when characters have both shared and own abilities.
4)In some parts of the story the game isn't clear. The explanations aren't enough and sometimes it made me wonder.
5)The only characters we see what really happened(what they were thinking,or feeling, or wondering about whatever) to them during the game are Tifa and Cloud. As for the others the game gave us the info about their lives but during the game we were just seeing their actions,not understanding their thoughts very clear.That's the thing I like in X-2 although the game wasn't good. In every twist of the plot Yuna would give an aspect of her opinions or her motives.

Back then these flaws were invisible to me.Maybe because I was too young.
I see them today, although they do not stop me from loving and enjoying this game. That is the reason I still like and love this game and I think of it as a good game.I don't call it mediocre or terrible because this would mean that these flaws make it un-enjoyable and irritating. But this is not happening to me. It's "flaws" just not affect me.

Thanks Norse FTX for trying to understand both sides and for your polite responds.

I don't really care about graphics, so the way the character models look have nothing to do with my decision. The music wasn't bad for it's time, but most of it didn't really make the story more interesting because it was boring.

It was great for its time, I agree...
I see its flaws too...

I don't think I'm about to abandon it just because I see new things, though....

Don't think of FF7 itself as becoming "Worse"...it wasn't "Aging horribly, flaws becoming apparent", since it's not changing!
Think that things in general are becoming better!
And FF7 was another part of that path to better-ness, as all games, in some way, were...=]

I've always thought it's important to respect the origin of things. (Don't dwell on them, of course...! But don't toss them aside, either!)

if you look at it that way...then respect FF 4 and 6!
i bought FF7 when it came out and regretted every waking moment of owning the game...why?!
because i had played the before mentioned games and saw 7 as a step back from where Square had been
i SOLD FF7 as soon as i beat it and ended up using the money a couple years later to buy Valkyrie Profile which offered everything that FF7 wasn't...
id est: hard, had an involving storyline, multiple endings, extremely interesting battle system, and a main character that doesn't allow party members to jump out of her body
7 was boring, and i found it a chore to play through it....if it wasn't for my friends telling me that there were insanely hard optional bosses, i wouldn't have continued......later on, i found that these bosses could be defeated rather easily when i accidentally used dazers on them
so go ahead and argue that Cloud is the most badass Square character or that FF7 has the deepest story because one character died...i don't care...as long as your arguments are baseless and hold no weight, i'll continue to disregard them

Mm...
I respect the older ones too, and the newer ones for the same reason. =]

I know there are some people who are kind of weird and just say that "Cloud is the best and could beat everyone else" or something like that...
But even if they're stubborn and argue with you, after a certain point, they usually know what you're talking about already (and probably think you're right, too)...they just won't say that they will change their mind, because regardless of how much proof is against them, there is no proof that can say that they don't love the game.
That usually doesn't come out in an argument, though, so things often get out of hand, since sometimes it's hard to get to the heart of what you're feeling when you're angry....

Why is it everytime you turn around its another ff7 is great/ ff7 is crap war? I don't know if it's popular for gameplay or just for arguements. Really, all games have flaws, if someone votes swiss cheese best cheese ever are you going to honestly compile a list of reason why it sucks? Games, like all forms of media are biased to terms of your liking, some people like second rate graphics with stange yet somewhat compelling stories, and others don't, why has a joke thread become SERIOUS BUSINESS?

Buzz off and take your equivalency bullshit with you. plzkthxbye

Equivalency not at all. I wouldn't even wipe my ass with the FF7 handbook. I just think games are partial to different people. FF7 was a waste of 3 days of my life, when I could have been... masturbating would be a better way tarnish my soul.

={
That was mean!

...<<
There is no such thing as a waste of your time! There's always something you get from every moment....don't ever feel like you're wasting your time--don't punish yourself like that...since you never are really wasting time!
If you're wasting time, then your entire life could be counted as "wasting time". But that's only one way to see things....

how's this sound?
FF7 was a waste of my money...i sold it for less than i bought it...which is already a loss, but i eventually bought Xenogears and Valkyrie Profile.....BOTH of which are everything that FF7 is not....id est....great games

Ah...
I usually enjoy every game I play, in some way....so I've never thought of selling my games before....
Hm. Maybe I'm too easy to please, then...? << Since I always feel like I get my money's worth....and if that's the case, then my opinion doesn't count as much, since I'm so easy to impress....

I'm critical of the work of myself, but not the work others.

<<
I think at least you found out that you didn't like FFVII, and you were able to get some of the money back, and find other games using that money that you enjoyed....

Buzz off and take your equivalency bullshit with you. plzkthxbye

Your a twat!!

Your opinion is invalidated due to your overwhelming stupidity. Furthermore, it has been decided that you should seek castration at the earliest possible convenience in order to prevent the further spread of said stupidity throughout the human genome. While it is generally recommended that such a procedure be performed by a medical professional, a special exception has been made in your case. Please feel free to castrate yourself using unsterilized household utensils, as a severe infection resulting in death would be a preferable.

What the fuck, how did this thread got revived?

Manga Legend, you are a piece of shit! SHIT, you hear me! That's all that you are! SHIT!

Calm down missus, your a twat too.

oh no....not another one that can't use the right "you're"....and from England to boot

Oh yeah, tis a good job we have got an English tutor in the hizoose. Cheers mate, you could give us a hand with the old punctuation too.

Oh and Prak, doesn`t it seem a waste of time and energy to write such a long reply to my post about you been a twat. Seema a little sad mate.

You read it and have no retort for it, so it seems it was not wasted. Try insulting me again when you grow a third brain cell.

Hey Prak! If you had 2 brains you'd be twice as stupid!!!11! lolololololol

Hey Prak! If you had 2 brains you'd be twice as stupid!!!11! lolololololol

if he had two, he'd probably give you one so you can stop with the nonsense

Oh yeah, tis a good job we have got an English tutor in the hizoose. Cheers mate, you could give us a hand with the old punctuation too.

Oh and Prak, doesn`t it seem a waste of time and energy to write such a long reply to my post about you been a twat. Seema a little sad mate.

To the abortion bin with you!

Is it just me, or is it kind of odd that nearly every time Prak calls a half-wit fanboy on his neurotic crap, the best that they do is some lame excuse at implying he has no life for posting on a FF forum?

To the abortion bin with you!

It must really suck been you.

It must really suck been you.

Are you even capable of typing coherently? Or is the burden of clear thought and intelligence too much for your nigger ass?

Is it just me, or is it kind of odd that nearly every time Prak calls a half-wit fanboy on his neurotic crap, the best that they do is some lame excuse at implying he has no life for posting on a FF forum?

Indeed. What's the point of replying to me if they're simply going to prove even further that I'm superior to them?

Manga --- you really shouldn't waste your time. That's too bad --- I've seen you before in other sections and thought maybe you were a bit smarter than that.

It must really suck been you.

what the hell is that supposed to mean?!

In other sections?, living up to the name of Manga Legend, I s`pose I`m wasting my time slagging Prak off and I like my incoherent typing.

Just don`t like people who think they know it all and this forum is full of em.

I remember you now. You're that idiot. Seeing the "chocograf" thread again made it all clear.

Well, you've certainly done a good job of proving you know pretty much nothing.

In other sections?, living up to the name of Manga Legend, I s`pose I`m wasting my time slagging Prak off and I like my incoherent typing.

Just don`t like people who think they know it all and this forum is full of em.

So you have a fetish for stupidity?

"A fetish for stupidity?" Whew... heh heh heh...

In other sections?, living up to the name of Manga Legend, I s`pose I`m wasting my time slagging Prak off and I like my incoherent typing.

Just don`t like people who think they know it all and this forum is full of em.


what the hell is that supposed to mean?!

Hey let's not make fun English may not be his first language. Just because he's in England doesn't mean he was born there.

If you post on a Forum, then you should be able to read and write coherently in whatever language it may be.

If you post on a Forum, then you should be able to read and write coherently in whatever language it may be.

x2

Hey let's not make fun English may not be his first language. Just because he's in England doesn't mean he was born there.

Haha what a stupid cunt.

I dunno, Prak and Joan-Michele get away with constantly writing arrogant, self-loving bullshit.

But theirs is intelligent and usually relevant.

No, just bullshit. Lot`s of it.

This coming from you? Riiight. :rolleyes:

lollin at Manga Legend once again.

No, just bullshit. Lot`s of it.

Compared to the putrid bile of aborted fetuses and tubgirl's ass juice you constantly spew out with every post you make. Our "bullshit" is practically Fancy Feast.

IOW, I'd tell you to kiss my ass and eat shit, but that'd be doing you a favour. You're THAT pathetic, now make like an emo and jump into a running wood-chipper, head-first.

Fancy Feast.

;)

lol, FF7

ARE YOU GUYS TRADING POKEMON CARDS BEHIND MY BACK?!?!?! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQjjgZdWUw8&NR)

Hey Desert Wolf where in Ireland are you from?? Oh and a reply to your question I feel the same as you. FF7 is the best game ever. The second BEST is Fable: The Lost Chapters. And third is FF Tactics.

Wow, the only response that post deserves is LOL.

Actually, the only response that post deserves is roffle ROTFL :D :D :D ha ha ha ha ha ha ha...

Actually, the only response that post deserves is roffle ROTFL :D :D :D ha ha ha ha ha ha ha...
x2

Actually, the only response that post deserves is roffle ROTFL :D :D :D ha ha ha ha ha ha ha...

x3. Wow.

What are you talking about!

What are you talking about good sir?

Actually, the only response that post deserves is roffle ROTFL :D :D :D ha ha ha ha ha ha ha...

x4

these two idiots seem stupid enough to get lost in an elevator

Wow, the only response that post deserves is LOL.


Why does it deserve LOL!! You must not have much to do than to just randomly pick this post and put something like LOL in it.

The best part, you don't even know why it's LOL.

Brilliant.

Why does it deserve LOL!! You must not have much to do than to just randomly pick this post and put something like LOL in it.

it deserves "LOL" because it is as baseless as the other "ff7 is the best ever" arguments that float around meaninglessly on the internet

Well instead of being so rude then you 2 should start a new thread talking about that topic.

OMG, I'm surprised I'm not literally on the floor yet...