I've been reading these (http://neojaponisme.com/2011/12/02/the-great-shift-in-japanese-pop-culture-part-five/) articles about Japanese market and culture and I've found some interesting tidbits about what's been happening to anime lately. What I would like to know is 1) What's your personal impression towards anime since the 90's and 2) What is your perception of today's status of anime.

I'd like to know because some of us have exchanged impressions on other threads, but would like to have an open discussion in a new thread. I'm 35 y.o., I'm very concious I'm not the demography of today's anime and that my nostalgia googles may play an important part, yet I'm still open to new experiences.

So, let's hear all of you!

Not really sure how to answer this. Anime has only gotten better since the 90's with the more established industry and newer tech. It's true that fan-service and fetishes have gotten more prominent over the years, but there are still great anime available today. My perception is that anime is a lot more socially popular now, especially in the video game community.

Once upon a time, anime used to be made by human beings... now it's made by computers. There is no substitute for artistry, and for that uniquely beautiful look that comes when something is assembled by hand. I miss the flawed but visually gorgeous anime of yesteryear - but that said, my favourite era was probably the late seventies, early eighties. That's exclusively from the visual perspective. Story wise, I think there's still some good stuff out there... but what with the Japanese economic downturn they're taking fewer risks these days; why take a chance and throw some money at something that might be a work of genius - and may fail miserably... when you can make a formula show on the cheap you know will do moderately well - enough to pay your salary and keep your studio afloat for another six months?

I have great hopes that the industry will recover and that new blood will emerge. The jury's still out on Yamakan - personally, I think he's got a lot to offer but whether he ever does is another matter.

We shall see, I suppose.

As far as anime's popularity and social acceptability... by and large, it doesn't exist in the UK. If anime has any mainstream recognition it's through Pokemon - maybe Bleach or Naruto. If you tell anybody you're into anime you'll likely get a) ignored, b) accused of being a pedophile, or c) a glimmer of recognition - "Isn't that Chinese cartoons like that big Owl dude with the umbrella, Tomomo, wasn't it? My Best Mate Tomomo? Yeah, I know those Korean shows. They're cool,, I guess" followed by being ignored.

Once in a blue moon you'll get something more than that... but let's just say I live a very lonely life as an anime fan in the real world in this country.

In Japan, it seems to be as it always was.

For me stuff hasn't really changed over the years, in regards to what gets produced... Fetishes and fan-service are present even in old productions, you still get 'silly' series which are just there to have you switch off the brain... and sometimes gems which dare to go a bit further. Same 'crap', better 'visual quality'.

I miss my Elfen Lied, though.

All I know is the quality of animation has gone down. Maybe not in all but in the anime I know it has.

For example this beautiful drawing.




Compared to this. Looks like a child did it. And this is a movie!






I think the new "tech" is just making them lazy.
And I know there has been bad animation in the past to, but that an exception.

My favorite period is long gone, twenty years behind us.

as for the status of Anime in France, the situation is better than in the UK. you don't get accused of being Pedobear's long los cousin for saying you like anime. People of my generation (30-40 years old) grew up watching anime, from Grendizer to Saint Seiya to Hokuto No Ken to Creamy Mami. There were a bit of trouble a dozen years ago (it started when catholic pressure groups got annoyed both by Sailor Moon Miniskirt, Ranma's transexuality and Ken's weekly slaughters on TV. but it has calm down since then. we've got magazines, lots and lots of cons, covered in a rather good way in the media, and cultural events related to mangas aren't uncommon.

All I know is the quality of animation has gone down. Maybe not in all but in the anime I know it has.

For example this beautiful drawing.




Compared to this. Looks like a child did it. And this is a movie!






I think the new "tech" is just making them lazy.
And I know there has been bad animation in the past to, but that an exception.

Agreed. Some of the recent Saint Seiya anime had painful to watch CGI where the old anime had really great stuff for the same kind of scenes.

As Tango already said, the anime industry has been much more risk averse than it was in the 70's and 80's. Most new anime shows are adaptations of popular manga and light novel series whose stories have already proven to be successful. The industry itself is still rolling like it has been, but with much more focus on already-existing fans, including otakus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otaku). In Japan, liking anime, especially as a girl, is harshly frowned upon. According to some working Japanese men and women, the only airing anime series that you can proudly express somewhat of an enthusiasm is One Piece.
Personally, the last creative/unique anime that I enjoyed was Tatami Galaxy - hence my username... :) On a slightly less relevant note, I should check out Space Brothers as I hear many good things about it.

The vast majority of anime is junk, but I don't think it's wise to disregard it for this reason. There are still good ones like JoJo's Bizarre Adventure, HUNTER x HUNTER, Steins;Gate, Another...

the only airing anime series that you can proudly express somewhat of an enthusiasm is One Piece.

Haha! Quoted for truth.

I was sitting in a bar in Tokyo a couple of years back, just doing people watching. This guy at the other end of the bar spotted me - I think his Gaijin detector went off, because next thing I know there's this really really drunk Salaryman staggering up behind me with what appeared to be both hands down his trousers having a good old rummage. As he got closer I realised his hands were in his trouser pocket - which was a massive relief. He pulled out his mobile phone and thrust it in my face, trilling gleefully "HAI, YOU SEI KEITAI???" - his phone was completely and utterly covered in One Piece stuff. Not just a case, but little things glued to it, hand-painted things, glitter, the works - the sort of thing you expect to see perhaps on a Japanese girl's phone...

"ME IS RAIKU WAN PISU! YOU HAS SEI WAN PISU? IS PIRATO ANIME! *HIC* MAI KEITAI IS WAN PISU, YOU RIKE? YOU KANTRU HAS WAN PISU? VELY FAME!"

And on, and on he went... I was so bloody humiliated... because I had to tell the poor guy I'd never seen a single episode of One Piece in my entire life! I told him I liked Gundam and he sorta lost interest after that... which I can't say disappointed me all that much...

I've been watching since 97 and feel that many of the golden age epic shows have come and gone (Fushigi Yugi, Escaflowne, Kenshin, Utena, 12 Kingdoms, Slayers, Cowboy bebop) and we seemed to be in a silver age with still great shows like Shiki, Natsume Yujin Cho, Fairy Tail, Kiaba, Future Diary, Daughter of 20 Faces, Spice and Wolf, but they are now spread further apart. I long for the return of great epics like Escaflowne which hit every note right from writing, pacing, art style and music (oh god the music) but I think that the studios are to afraid to push the envelope (although I have yet to see Space Brothers and Claymore - their on my list and here their top notch).

You know, I was actually thinking about bringing up Escaflowne. Now that was a show. Beautifully written, beautifully (HAND) drawn, beautifully scored. Escaflowne fired on all cylinders. It just had a momentum. A feeling of "HOLY CRAP LET'S GO FOR IT!!!" - exuberance, joy, attention to detail, the desire to create. Young(er) people will claim that 1996 was a lifetime ago, but it really wasn't... Compared against the history of animation, Escaflowne was yesterday. But finances in Japan were looking quite healthy then... and a) largely no piracy, and b) no digital distribution meant DVDs and CDs sold like hotcakes. We're in a different world now. I like to think that another Escaflowne could still happen today - but I have a feeling that, at least at the moment the odds are stacked against it.

But we can always be sure well get another series of Pretty Cure or Jewelpet next year..

[Edit: Space Brothers is my favourite series of 2012 - but for the story - the art is functional. Are there any really great new shows art-wise I should be looking at? :)

I've been watching since 97 and feel that many of the golden age epic shows have come and gone (Fushigi Yugi, Escaflowne, Kenshin, Utena, 12 Kingdoms, Slayers, Cowboy bebop) and we seemed to be in a silver age with still great shows like Shiki, Natsume Yujin Cho, Fairy Tail, Kiaba, Future Diary, Daughter of 20 Faces, Spice and Wolf, but they are now spread further apart. I long for the return of great epics like Escaflowne which hit every note right from writing, pacing, art style and music (oh god the music) but I think that the studios are to afraid to push the envelope (although I have yet to see Space Brothers and Claymore - their on my list and here their top notch).

That's the issue, though. There's a lot more anime so it's hard to discern what's good. The junk anime was added in, not converted to.

You have to put in the equation the total faggots that are growing up now in the justin bieber/internet generation. They have about as much class and sophistication as a potato.
The demand for skillful thoughtful products has gone down due to them.

That's the issue, though. There's a lot more anime so it's hard to discern what's good. The junk anime was added in, not converted to.

Exactly. I check the usual places and there is SO much I can't decide what is worth the time and what's not. Sure, I've seen JoJo and been trying to get started with Stein:gate, but the first episode was so boring the first 15 minutes I couldn't get myself to finish it. Will try again later. And "mainstream" hits like Sword Art://Sign... I mean, Online... you get my point.

What is worth watching today? I've been following Saint Seiya Omega and if that's what goes as anime nowadays, please kill me.

the state of anime today is simply FUCKING DEPLORABLE. 7 out of 10 anime releases are certifiably high school comedy-drama, with the SAME recycled characters (the obnoxious male protagonist, the bitch, the shy female friend, etc) and they all look the same: like middleschool girls.
this is why im still collecting my childhood anime. they may not be, in retrospect, as good as one remembers them. but by hades they are still better than the majority of todays shit

You know, I was actually thinking about bringing up Escaflowne. Now that was a show. Beautifully written, beautifully (HAND) drawn, beautifully scored. Escaflowne fired on all cylinders. It just had a momentum. A feeling of "HOLY CRAP LET'S GO FOR IT!!!" - exuberance, joy, attention to detail, the desire to create. Young(er) people will claim that 1996 was a lifetime ago, but it really wasn't... Compared against the history of animation, Escaflowne was yesterday. But finances in Japan were looking quite healthy then... and a) largely no piracy, and b) no digital distribution meant DVDs and CDs sold like hotcakes. We're in a different world now. I like to think that another Escaflowne could still happen today - but I have a feeling that, at least at the moment the odds are stacked against it.

But we can always be sure well get another series of Pretty Cure or Jewelpet next year..

[Edit: Space Brothers is my favourite series of 2012 - but for the story - the art is functional. Are there any really great new shows art-wise I should be looking at? :)

Escaflowne, to me at least, is one of the best thing to come out in the nineties. But don't forget that in a way, Fan-service isn't new. Sailor moon had fan-service, hell, in a way Cutey Honey WAS fan service. yet, I think more work was put into designs, character development, storylines...And a lot more risk were taken. but as you say, financial matters haqve forced for a "safer" approach to animation, with immediate rentability as a key (If I remember correctly, Escaflowne, as good as it was, was more or less a commercial failure in Japan ?)

Exactly. I check the usual places and there is SO much I can't decide what is worth the time and what's not. Sure, I've seen JoJo and been trying to get started with Stein:gate, but the first episode was so boring the first 15 minutes I couldn't get myself to finish it. Will try again later. And "mainstream" hits like Sword Art://Sign... I mean, Online... you get my point.

What is worth watching today? I've been following Saint Seiya Omega and if that's what goes as anime nowadays, please kill me.

Please. don't mention it. head hurts now. :mad:

Every time I hear of a new saint seiya spin off/ sequel / remake, my head hurts. Same as with DBZ kai. Hell, DBGT was already a bad idea, and it was close to 20 years ago. THe last VERY good thing I saw was Full MEtal Alchemist...and it's starting to get a tad old. and that rehashing of old anime is annoying me. i've seen DBZ. all 291 episodes, plus the movies. I have no need for a remake. Same goes for Saint Seiya. Kurumada should have let it go, although in that case, fans are partially to blame. I remember petiotionning for the release of Hades. I didn't know we'd start a shitstorm that produced Saint Seiya Episode G, Next Dimension and worse than all, Omega. Lost Canvas was good in manga form, but I don't know how well it old in animated form.

Fanservice is nothing new, you're right. But if you check the article I pointed out, you'll have the answer of why most of what is released nowadays is crap: they're appealing to specialized niches, since the traditional middle-class consumer is not buying anymore. Japan cares not for the tastes of the gaijin. They bet we'll buy whatever bone they throw our way. They care to sell in their own market, but since the everyday man is spending less and less on them, they have to cater to specific niches to survive: shonen with yankii characteristics, loli-centered anime with fanservice-to-the-extreme, etc. If I'm wrong, feel free to counter my argument.

I grew bored with anime years ago (the last two series I really liked were Last Exile and Ah! My Goddess TV series) - nowadays it's degenerated mostly into sugar-coated or overly angsty and gratuitously violent fluff trying desperately to either emulate DBZ, yet another bland high-school girl comedy (often with thinly-veiled occult or fantasy elements), harem show with a bland male geek surrounded by every female stereotype imaginable, schoolgirl in a fantasy world that resembles feudal Japan, or an apocalyptic mecha show inexplicably using high school kids as pilots (see a pattern here?). And anime films are just as bad - most just seem now to be trying to ride Studio Ghibli's coattails without offering anything new or interesting.

I dare say the days of Akira and the original Evangelion are long gone. Sure there was a lot of crap anime back then too, but the large amount of new and interesting shows and films being released at the time made up for the rubbish. Now... urrrghh.

the state of anime in my house is very dead.
save a few series.
i really only have Witch Hunter Robin.
good series, only lasted one run. 26 episodes, iirc.

only a few movies i've watched but not kept: Vampire Hunter D, Akira, Appleseed, Ghost In the Shell.
also a few Hayao Miyazaki films as well: Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away, Naussica and the Valley of the Wind, Howl's Moving Castle, Castle in the Sky, My Neighbor Totorro.

I want to try a few more series, but nothing serious.
Anything more than 10 seasons is too much, imo.
Hell, anything beyond 3 is too much for me.

I'm still trying to catch up on live action shows!!!

Robotech. I loved that series as a kid.
don't know the actual history of the series if it was translated poorly or it was never in Japanese or if the Japanese audio was lost forever or what...

Only ever had the Macross movie to watch a million times over.
Done. With. That. Movie.

Anime is about cute shit nowadays, and remaking something that old well over again into something "new." The classics are long since gone, and while there may be a diamond in the rough, chances are good it's crap. Personally, if it wasn't on the Toonami/Adult Swim circuit Pre-2006, it's not that great. Though I'm aware stuff like Evagelion, Escaflowne, Robotech, etc. are great, they personally aren't my style, and I exclude them from the "crap" statement.

Cowboy Bebop, Trigun, DBZ, Big O, Outlaw Star, Gundam Wing, 08th MS Team, 0083, FLCL, Yu Yu Hakusho, Rurouni Kenshin, .Hack//Sign, Wolf's Rain, Fullmetal Alchemist....hell, even stuff I wasn't into like Tenchi, & Blue Sub had so much more depth to the story. There was always this philosophical/moral quandary to it. Made you really think, and things weren't generic at all. Taught you some pretty useful things as a kid anyway, Cowboy Bebop Trigun and Wolf's Rain alone taught you that the world wasn't a very friendly place, but that you could live in it. "It ain't much, but it's a living," Jet Black would say. I'm actually watching Ronin Warriors right now, it's a little cheesier than DBZ, given the time period it was made it, but it's still pretty solid. Next I need to see if Pilot Candidate was any good. I only ever saw a couple of episodes.

Holy hell can't believe I forgot about Inuyasha. I used to be obsessed, till I learned that it never even ended. Kills your fandom when you realize it's just a huge circle of nothing. Atleast until The Final Act came out.....oh.....i dont know........10 years-ish after the series first aired? I aint waiting that long for a wrap up.

I think it's an illusion. Toonami aired anime that was originally published at different intervals in Japan. They hand-picked the good ones.

You know, I was actually thinking about bringing up Escaflowne. Now that was a show. Beautifully written, beautifully (HAND) drawn, beautifully scored. Escaflowne fired on all cylinders. It just had a momentum. A feeling of "HOLY CRAP LET'S GO FOR IT!!!" - exuberance, joy, attention to detail, the desire to create. Young(er) people will claim that 1996 was a lifetime ago, but it really wasn't... Compared against the history of animation, Escaflowne was yesterday. But finances in Japan were looking quite healthy then... and a) largely no piracy, and b) no digital distribution meant DVDs and CDs sold like hotcakes. We're in a different world now. I like to think that another Escaflowne could still happen today - but I have a feeling that, at least at the moment the odds are stacked against it.

But we can always be sure well get another series of Pretty Cure or Jewelpet next year..

[Edit: Space Brothers is my favourite series of 2012 - but for the story - the art is functional. Are there any really great new shows art-wise I should be looking at? :)

You forgot that the final episodes were rushed because the studio was run by idiots.

I <3 Escaflowne.

I think it's an illusion. Toonami aired anime that was originally published at different intervals in Japan. They hand-picked the good ones.

Yeah, but most of those for Toonami were in the '89 to ~ '95-ish time of development in Japan. AS picked up to 2000-ish maybe, other than a few series. It's been 10 years since Toonami quit. Can you name enough "diamonds in the rough" to fill a varied Toonami timeline (since it changed throughout the decade)?

We'll just have to wait and see. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlPRU7hDbsE#t=15m40s)

Well there goes the next 2 hours of my life. Wasn't aware they were at a con.

The state of anime currently is pretty bad. Most cater to Otaku and their rampant moe/oppai/loli fetishes leaving mostly harems, "club" anime & tragically dull moes. Even some of the anime that do try something different often fail hard because of an underdeveloped plot, inconsistencies, weak/unlikable characters, cliches, deus ex machinas like you better believe, etc. (Steins;Gate & Robotics;Notes definitely come to my mind here) However there are gems that arise within the cesspool of junk. Animes of recent like Tiger & Bunny, Eden of the East (Anime Only), Fractale, Hanasaku Iroha, & Psycho-Pass (There are probably more but this was off the top of my head) are definitely ones worth checking out and they show a glimmer of hope that good anime can still exist even in such an exploitative time.

I didn't mention shonens because come on... they're pretty much all suck besides Jojo's Bizarre Adventure as of late.

Has anyone seen Saint Seiya Tenkai Hen Overture? Is it me or it's a work of art?

Has anyone seen Saint Seiya Tenkai Hen Overture? Is it me or it's a work of art?

Haven't seen it yet, but that will change very soon.

Has anyone seen Saint Seiya Tenkai Hen Overture? Is it me or it's a work of art?

you mean the quasi remake of the third movie? looks flashy as hell, but its boring as fuck.

As a product: Everything has improved (animation, budget, marketing and other stuff).

Quality: The most popular (commercial) anime series are bad, always gay looking guys, copies, boring stories and stupid fight scenes. Perfect for yaoi fangirls and stupid guys. The not so popular anime series are fine.

All I know is the quality of animation has gone down. Maybe not in all but in the anime I know it has.

For example this beautiful drawing.




Compared to this. Looks like a child did it. And this is a movie!






I think the new "tech" is just making them lazy.
And I know there has been bad animation in the past to, but that an exception.

not for nothing, but Toei productions are kinda a shitty example of animation getting worse imo

as they've always been pretty bad to me (or got to be after a certain point in the show's run) for as long as I can remember

anime is way better than western cartoon.... personally anime ISN'T UNDER ANY WAY ARE CARTOONS!

anime is 100% better than crappy western baby cartoons and way better drawn... in japan most advertising is using anime style.... you don't get that in the western world, anime/manga has my respects comics don't (with the exception of marvel)

anime/manga has my respects comics don't (with the exception of marvel)


implying this




sucks.


get your facts straight, kid.

Marvel is better than DC

Marvel has Stan Lee (my greatest respects to him) in virtually every Marvel film.

If I had to choose a favourite between Tony Stark and Bruce Wayne... Tony is better cause his one liners are hilarious and not depressing as Bruce... Marvel has way better superheroes than DC...

thats why in the marvel vs dc comic. dc won due to batman, right?
in other words: batman >>>> the entirety of marvel.

Batman was always the best in terms of comics. In my opinion all the films were appalling - they didn't live up to the expectations which were subliminally implanted through having read the comics. It's a bit like judging a book by its cover, but in this case judging a number of movie franchises by the books.

>AFMG

The new Anime. Hmmm... tricky topic. Hmmm...ing some more. By 'new' you're implying there is a discernible difference between two or more groups of Animes. I'm not sure it matters as long as the show is entertaining and delivers to Anime fans. Only Anime fans will know what that is. For instance, I still think Gatchaman, or even its butchered sister released in the West as Battle of the Planets is a fine show, and that started in 1972! I haven't seen the 2004 remake yet, and to be honest I'm not sure I would want to, as it may not feel right, even if it has fancy CGI.

With respect to computer graphics, Anime artists usually put a lot of effort in their work to make it look right. I have to say I liked The Skycrawlers. I don't think I've seen anything more recent than that. I kind of like the old school stuff.

I'll edit this post when/if I get a useful idea.

Only the current batman movies I like, BUT anime movies like the studio Ghibli series are way better more creative. Dispite what people say here anime and manga are more popular than comics (and anyone saying manga is comins are deluded, IT'S NOT THE SAME!) my local dorbidden planet has a larger mana section which is 4 times larger than the comic section and clearly labels MANGA and COMICS seperately. What sells more gets more space... I'd rather live in a mana world than a dull world of comics

Too many dancing school girls and cute fuzzy animals nowadays. The animation looks nice, but the stories not so much. I haven't really kept up on the recent anime scene, so I don't know if I missed any that are good.

Studio Ghibli will always be superior to ANY western ainimated films... When American so called 'manga' or 'Wanga' is made, us manga is so poor and a lame imitation... Some westerners seem to think its just hand in comic strip and it makes you a comic writer... WRONG! Read the manga series Bakuman, in Japan budding manga writers have to submit a one shot which doesn't make it published. It has to be judged by the editor before being published then it has to pass popularity polls with the public, get a lot of votes you get serialised then you have to be even more popular to get a animated series. Japan just doesn't slap out an anime because there's a manga of it. Batman only got made into a film series because the studios saw a money making chance. Just because a character is popular doesn't make the film adaptation good.


Plus I prefer Japanese bunny girls to over cheesy super heroes

I think the most noticiable transition of the anime era is the fanservice. I ain't gonna hate on that though, I'm cool with it. You guys should check out One Piece. Over the past 13 years you can really see the boobs of the characters grow to ridiculous proportions! Not only that but the harem genre has really taken off too, every second anime in the school life setting is filled with the 1 guy, x girls concept. I don't know how many of you have read or seen Love Hina but that was shuttle that let the genre take off. Art wise has been hit and miss.

I doubt any of you keep up with Pokemon but recently Ash got his Charizard back. It's exactly what COCONUT MILK was saying earlier, the artists have gotten lazy and all the animation has become flat and undetailed. Charizard now obviously lacks the hand drawn details he had in the past, it's made me sad. On the bright side, the CGI and special effects have really come out in recent anime. Shows like Fate Zero really take this era of anime to it's limits. I can't wait to find out what sort of anime will come out the next era, movie production quality perhaps :)

Didn't TENCHI MUYO predate LH?

eternally Anime will always > Western cartoons

anyone who thinks comics & cartoons > manga & Anime are clearly delusional...

the truth is anime will never be bested by cartoons (WHICH ARE NOT THE SAME!)

Didn't TENCHI MUYO predate LH?
Yup it does, I remember watching it on adult swim and loved it. but the biggest kick starter to the genre was love hina, all my friends would go gaga over narusegawa hahaha

Tenchi Muyo before Love Hina. I need to watch both, mostly the later TM series.

If you only watch shows that have a battle every episode, you're gonna have a bad time trying to find good anime today. There's been some really good releases in recent years, though, so I'm not sure where all this "it used to be better" bs comes from.

anime is way better than western cartoon.... personally anime ISN'T UNDER ANY WAY ARE CARTOONS!

anime is 100% better than crappy western baby cartoons and way better drawn... in japan most advertising is using anime style.... you don't get that in the western world, anime/manga has my respects comics don't (with the exception of marvel)

Disney and Pixar movies,Rugrats, Hey, Arnold!, Doug, Ren and Stimpy, Samurai Jack, Powerpuff Girls, Johnny Bravo, Dexter's Laboratory, Jem and the Holograms, TMNT, Swat Kats, Duck Tales, Tail Spin, Gargoyles, Batman the Animated Series, Avatar the Last Airbender, Spider Man, and X-men would like to have a word with you. Japanese cartoons (yes, that's right I called them cartoons because cartoon and anime are actually interchangable) are better than their western counterparts in terms of content and content only. When they actually bother to animate their works instead of using stills or panning they immediately rise to the top. Other than that, they use the same time and money saving tricks that Western works use. Your Japanophilic tendencies are almost laughable because you give anime more praise than it really deserves. Granted, I would rather watch a Japanese anime than any currently running American animated program but that's not the point.

You say that personally anime are not cartoons. It doesn't matte what you think personally. The term anime and cartoon mean the same. Japanese anime/cartoons are different than Western cartoons in terms of content (again) and the fact that they are made in a different country, and that is a fact. Your personal feelings do not enter the equation.

Crappy Western baby cartoons as you call them is downright an insult to the people who enjoyed those programs and those who worked dilligently on them. Some of them were indeed not well made and were not successful, but there are the Japanese equivalent that are not well made as well. You can't talk crap about one and completely ignore the other. That means you are intellectually biased, my friend. Japanese anime character are definitely well drawn in terms of being more aesthetically pleasing, because the Japanese simply want to focus on that more than American cartoons that want to entertain or tell a story. American productions are not without their aesthetically pleasing works, mind you, there are just fewer of them. This is not a bad thing.

Japan uses their same drawing style in advertisements. Is this supposed to make some sort of point? American companies use animation, mostly CGI in some of their advertisements as well - albeit most are directed at children. So what?

Anime and manga do not deserve your "respect" because they have not done anything to earn it. American cartoons and manga do not deserve your ignorance because they have done nothing to deserve it. Do a bit more research and broaden your horizons before you shut off the entertainment from one entire country because you "think" that Japan does it all better, all the time.

Disney and Pixar movies,Rugrats, Hey, Arnold!, Doug, Ren and Stimpy, Samurai Jack, Powerpuff Girls, Johnny Bravo, Dexter's Laboratory, Jem and the Holograms, TMNT, Swat Kats, Duck Tales, Tail Spin, Gargoyles, Batman the Animated Series, Avatar the Last Airbender, Spider Man, and X-men would like to have a word with you. Japanese cartoons (yes, that's right I called them cartoons because cartoon and anime are actually interchangable) are better than their western counterparts in terms of content and content only. When they actually bother to animate their works instead of using stills or panning they immediately rise to the top. Other than that, they use the same time and money saving tricks that Western works use. Your Japanophilic tendencies are almost laughable because you give anime more praise than it really deserves. Granted, I would rather watch a Japanese anime than any currently running American animated program but that's not the point.

You say that personally anime are not cartoons. It doesn't matte what you think personally. The term anime and cartoon mean the same. Japanese anime/cartoons are different than Western cartoons in terms of content (again) and the fact that they are made in a different country, and that is a fact. Your personal feelings do not enter the equation.

Crappy Western baby cartoons as you call them is downright an insult to the people who enjoyed those programs and those who worked dilligently on them. Some of them were indeed not well made and were not successful, but there are the Japanese equivalent that are not well made as well. You can't talk crap about one and completely ignore the other. That means you are intellectually biased, my friend. Japanese anime character are definitely well drawn in terms of being more aesthetically pleasing, because the Japanese simply want to focus on that more than American cartoons that want to entertain or tell a story. American productions are not without their aesthetically pleasing works, mind you, there are just fewer of them. This is not a bad thing.

Japan uses their same drawing style in advertisements. Is this supposed to make some sort of point? American companies use animation, mostly CGI in some of their advertisements as well - albeit most are directed at children. So what?

Anime and manga do not deserve your "respect" because they have not done anything to earn it. American cartoons and manga do not deserve your ignorance because they have done nothing to deserve it. Do a bit more research and broaden your horizons before you shut off the entertainment from one entire country because you "think" that Japan does it all better, all the time.

With respect, those cartoons you list at the top are a pile of crap. The one good cartoon show you didn't mention is the Simpsons. Doh!

Regarding quality, I'm guessing that you're registered blind. Rugrats. LOL!

You joined in 2008, and this is your first post? WTF?

There's a lot of good american cartoons and yet he choses mostly crap. At least he got Batman and Avatar right.

What is the status of Anime nowadays?

Free pornography hidden with clothes and allowed pedophilia.

Anime is the same old contrived BS especially card-battle anime like Pokemon or Yugioh. Even most kids cartoons are better than most anime these days and actually changes things up! Anime has the same tired plots and just sucks these days. I don't know what happened but I think this started with card-battle anime now we just have copycats of card-battle anime. It's sad when cartoons are more innovative than most anime. What happened Japan?

the new animes everyone says it has awesome plot, was already done back in the 80ts and 90ts. Basically they have been recycling stuff...and adding their own weird fetish of big breats all over the place and the disturbing lolicon issue.
Rare, very rare to see a good anime that you can say it is NEW without fetish washing eyes thing

I think the boob fetish has a lot to do with it. Most anime that isn't kids anime is about BIG BOOBS everywhere, it's kind of sickening really! What is Japan's obsession with boobs and sex? It's getting to the point where anime is no longer OK to let kids watch which is why I said most carttoons are better than most anime. This may be acceptable in Japan but that won't fly in the US. The only animes without the boob fetish are kids anime which is the best kind of anime. Plus anime is very overrated now. I am sick of hearing about the anime Attack on Titan, for example. I hate to say this and I'll be hated for it but I'm starting to enjoy Disney Junior over anime! *shoots self*

DC Comics animated movies and series that are coming nowadays, are making miss the good old anime stuff I used to watch....
Everyone speaks of sword art online... for what they told me.... another rip off of hack sign..... seriously???
pokemon should die already... better. ASH SHOULD DIE! that is not a hero... it is just a stupid kid that is aiming to be a Pokemon trainer since 1999..... and he still didn't grew up... he still has 12 years since 1999.
Beyblade I grew to hate it, because it killed the tradition of my country toys. the TOP (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top). That in my country is more like this ().
I used to play that a lot, and now, because of beyblade, that toy is nowhere to be found.
Chinese stores sale false beyblade shit. Those beyblade toys are not even educative. the Top was very much more educative in precision and the way you handle it. What is beyblade educative thing? Oh, you push that zip thing and it rolls. -_- beyblade came in my country in 2002.

I remember when I saw AIKA original OVA in 1997-98. It was a pervert anime. Yes, but I never saw anything like that, and I did like it, not for the pervert thing, but I did like the story, and the soundtrack made by one that would be my favorite Japanese music composer (one of them).

Nowdays, pervert echi stuff, is too much. It's exagerated. It's horrible. Take Queens Blade, for example. The soundtrack is way to good for a shit like that. I never saw it, but the moment I see in an animated gif of someone a character from there squeezing her breasts and shooting milk out of it.... and some other character with "what the hell they drinking" breasts of the size of ... something really big. 0.o That throws me of.

I saw Highschool of The dead. Dammit my love for zombie stuff. That blond girl the first she appears I thought she was sleeping with her head on pillows.....
not... it were her breasts. Enormous. I spent the whole anime wishing she would die. What, she is the comic relief? It's outrageous recurring to a comic relief like that.
Japan is the Machist Nation. So yeah, they explore the women image to the bone. Sexploitation is done to the core.

Yeah I agree that Pokemon needs to die, but Beyblade is cool! Pokemon has been going for too damn long and we're at like 800 pokemon so it really does need to die. Unfortunately it will NEVER happen bc it's still so damn popular! I stopped watching Pokemon after Indigo league (Red & Blue). I watched some of Black & White but I can't keep up with it bc I haven't played the subsequent games. I do agree that the boob thing went too far!

Free pornography hidden with clothes and allowed pedophilia.

To say anime is allowed pedo material is where people with arrogant minds are! Anime is and will always be superior to western crap! Sure there's fan service but to say it pedo material makes you arrogant. Tell me where in DEATHNOTE there is a old man peeving at underage people?

---------- Post added at 05:22 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:16 AM ----------

What is considered pedo like material isn't pedo in Japan and besides most stuff like that is banned outright overthere... The reason why hentai isn't on TV there. If you wan 80's anime badly... One solution... Buy it on DVD on amazon it's not rocket science... I play pokemon and I don't give a toss if anyone knows but I don't watch the anime. If manga/anime is bad as you say try saying that to the 1000's of anime fans out there, you get slaughtered


Also comics better than manga??? DON'T MAKE ME LAUGH! Try reading the manga series Bakuman. It tells you how hard it is to be a best selling manga artist. It's harder to be a manga maker than 'comic' artist. Manga artists are pros, comic people ain't... With the exception of the Spider-Man creator, kudos to him

NEWS FLASH!!

we have a hit a sensitive spot on a pedo. If it's not a pedo... it's a fan boy that does not let anyone say the truth of reality thus calling others arrogant. When in fact he is the arrogant one bursting out like this.
oh and anime fans out there, are not anime fans.... are shit eaters. And they eat anything that is put in front of them even if it is the worst thing ever made, they will still adore it as godly.

You are the arrogant one, and you didn't understood anything of what I said. And I will not go through with this conversation with someone like you.

Honestly i have to agree with Orie for the most part.

I personally marathon all ongoing anime (unless it's a series following up on something I haven't watched yet). So i generally cycle through a lot of crappy stuff. Much of it is uninteresting or just down right stupid as it attempts to be original in some retarded way. The quality of anime has definitely declined over the years as it seems to try to pander to the otakus who will buy anything related to sex or fanservice.

But from a business perspective can you really blame them? On average it costs about 200,000-300,000 dollars to make ONE episode. That's right just one episode costs more than i'll probably make at my job in 3 decades. So that being the case it's best to pander to different crowds so that your show gets more attention from different groups of people, thus improving the odds you will turn up a profit or at least break even. So in a sense they are only doing the smart thing. Obviously i still don't approve of this but i can still understand where they are coming from.

Let's be real for a second though. I believe there is absolutely NO WAY to be completely original anymore. It's just not possible. Just about every idea has been done before in some shape or form. What makes you original is the way you bring your story together and whether the story is compelling, deep and entertaining. So i believe it's a bit naive to say nothing is original anymore (while it's true they are less original than they used to be).

These days i think people need to be a bit more open minded when it comes to watching anime. Sure everything doesn't make sense sometimes, sure characters have stupid motivations, sure there is no way that guy should have survived from an explosion at point blank etc. If you take things too seriously and worry about every single little detail i'd be surprised if you were able to enjoy anything at all tbh. Regardless of what you think EVERYTHING has something stupid about it. Nothing is perfect. Every show has it's flaws. But that doesn't it's bad. Everyone can find enjoyment out of anime these days no matter how absurd.

One thing you must understand is that people are joining the anime community EVERYDAY. I hate to admit it but most people who hate currently running anime are probably old anime veterans who have been watching it for years. So of course you've seen most of what anime has to offer. But to a person just joining the anime community they might possibly find joy in something that an old anime veteran has seen 20 times over. This is something Anime producers take in mind. They can't really appease the old anime fans anymore so they look towards entertaining the new ones (which are much bigger in numbers) with the same crap us veterans have witnessed for ages. Again it's just a smarter investment of time and money.

That being said i wouldn't turn away from watching new anime completely. There hasn't been a anime season yet where i didn't end up really liking at least 2-3 shows. Say what you may but there is still very good anime that comes out these days but they got lost among the pile of crap that gets spewed most of the time. I advise at least watching the first episode of each series. If it interests you even a LITTLE watch till episode 5. If you've lost interest by then you should probably drop it. Trust me there are some shows that i thought i would absolutely HATE but i ended up liking very much and even getting somewhat emotional once they ended (Sakurasou no Pet na Kanojo is the best example for me).

Kind of threw my thoughts all over the place but that's just my personal opinion. Take it how you will.

Most new anime series really are shit, it pretty much started going in a downward spiral in the mid-1990s imo. Some gems still come out, but you really do have to dig through a pile of trash to find it, and sometimes the trash looks like gems til you watch it, like some of the mecha series. Then there's the series that are great as a manga, might have had a video game, but have a horribly bland anime adaptation. Togainu no Chi is one of the worst offenders in that category. There's also anime like D.Gray-Man which catch up to the manga too fast and are left without material to further adapt for a full season, therefore ending. And I know that they're popular, but to me the three current big series in Japan (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece) are pretty much only halfway between pure crap and gems. They're ok series, but I really don't see how they're good enough to last this long.

I think most people's standards have also lowered though. Now what most people call great series do not quite come close to the excellence of some older series. I think most anime are going to use tropes, can't avoid them, and some of them are downright enjoyable and make more interesting characters. But in other cases, some of the tropes that get used and abused are the ones that make fans groan (or fanboys drool) like girls with over-sized boobs and passive-aggressive (tsundere) personalities. I think of necessity, quality is going to go down as the really good stuff no one's thought of before has all already been made, so we can expect to wade through a lot more crap and find much fewer gems than in the past.

Someone mentioned Dragon Ball Kai (the original title). I have to say, I don't see where the criticism comes from on that one. Kai was a better, filler-free remake of Dragon Ball Z that cut out the pointless crap added in by full anime seasons of fillers. I loved Dragon Ball Z and got to watch episodes of the original version, subtitled, while completely ignoring the fillers, but having a version that does that for me is even better. And for anyone who hasn't watched the original version of Dragon Ball Z, btw, you are really missing out. The english dub version was a brain-rotting, droll piece of crap with absolutely pathetic dialogue and completely modified BGMs that were repeated ad infinitum. The original had some great BGMs and the dialogue in it actually made sense. I can't recommend enough hunting down episodes of it.

DBK has some HORRID 'modern' animations.

If they'd JUST cut out filter, instead of 'adding' new scenes...
Then it would have been pretty good.


Even the DUB was screwed up.

I'm expecting to see the end of Berserk in my lifetime, if that's not much to ask...

@LeatherHead333: Since you have checked what is airing in the present, would you recommend your Top 5? Thanks.

@Tenku: I agree, neither Bleach, One Piece or Naruto could be considered crap, but are far from being damn good. And too long is too long.

Do you know Ethics?
Anime nowadays just throw that to the trash.
It's like (referring to lolicon), yeah Pedo is legal in japan, but not in other countries. So you accept pedo stuff anyway, just because it is legal in japan? If you think like that, what does that make you? That makes you and hidden Pedo on society. I don't care how some people may be hit with this, but it is true.

So the guy above (in some posts) who seem to agree with that:

Mewmew says:
:well he needs to understand the damage pedophilia does
: it doesn't matter if the country committing it considers it legal
: it SHOULD not be considered legal
: the very fact that he is okay with, means he is a pedophile
: he is just hiding behind the 'legality' of it in Japan, to look at pedophilia porn

The new generation of kids, is already fucked in education already, so yeah, they will accept anything that might "wash" their eyes and not bother to think why things are being done as they are.
We, old anime veterans, know very well in how we were educated of what is bad and wrong and what is good and right. So, yes.... Anime Nowadays are bad and wrong in so many levels. (Of course there are a few that stand out of that)
But supposed new Anime Fans don't see like that, because they will eat anything that is labeled "ANIME" or "JAPAN MADE" all over their brain, even if it s the worst shit ever, not , for them is good.
Another difference between Old Anime Veterans and New Anime fans: We didn't saw or think like that. We loved anime , Yes, but not the OBSESSED way the New anime fans are. Don't tell me otherwise, because they are the ones all itchy to make a cosplay of something. It's a matter of taste? Yes. I personally don't find it appealing and I see it as a loss of time. I admit, some cosplay are very well done. But what does that contribute? For futility issues. Because Japan is the Nation of Futility, and their good technology is wasted in futility. But hey, it works. Brainless people go buy anything they shit out of their ass.

Another though I got now.
Back then, old veterans did not had internet. Between friends, people would save money together to order from another country too see an anime VHS.
Nowadays it is internet, and (not saying everyone does that, but in my country seems to be the daily life of a new supposed anime fan) they see (eat) TERABITES of anime 24/7. But I still like the fact that these New Anime fans have no culture about anime at all. The culture they have and BAD is about the new anime... But go ask them who Is Yoshiaki Kawajiri.
And yes, everytime an anime fan comes to me in my country I humiliate him without mercy. Because they came to me like they know all about there is to be know about anime. The arrogance of these characters is of such extreme level that I really feel the need to be a Serial Killer.
I mostly compare new anime fans Arroganc to those supposed Flac audiophiles lovers (I had my share with A LOT of ARROGANT son's of bitches. Luckily some people are more open minded then those, they love flac, but they dont judge as a stupid living thing for not liking flac).

And no. I am not Close Minded in the anime nowadays. I am very Open Minded. But I am also very stuck in beliefs, and Lolicon is just as Disgusting as watching boobs scenes endlessly in the anime. Sorry. I am not that pervert to like something that rapes my beliefs.

Of course, Mile are the ones liking anime nowadays more. Because the Woman Image is being explored to every sexual thing in the disturbed ways.
I am a Male and I am against that. That shows how Japanese Machism goes. It goes beyond the lines of self control.

Name me some (non hentai) series that are lolicon series.

I honestly can't think of any, then again, I don't seek that shit out.

lolicon:
Skygirls, Strike Witches, Listen to Me, Girls. I Am Your Father! (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/anime.php?id=13756), Ro-Kyu-Bu!, Astarotte's Toy

Strike Witches...is lolicon?
O_O

Wow...didn't realize that.

I'm expecting to see the end of Berserk in my lifetime, if that's not much to ask...

@LeatherHead333: Since you have checked what is airing in the present, would you recommend your Top 5? Thanks.



These are in no particular order

1. Yahari Ore no Seishun Love Come wa Machigatteiru

Reasons: I'll admit i generally hate mostly all slice of life anime because it's just plain boring and unrealistic most of the time. However i found this one to be very entertaining because the MC is able to accurately break down and depict various social situations faced by teens in a high school setting and the psychology driving their interactions. It's one of the first animes i've watched that i could actually relate to a character on a personal level. Most MC's in slice of life animes are wimpy and stupid guys who SOMEHOW have every girl in school falling for them. The MC in this anime has been rejected, is pretty much a loner and keeps to himself whenever he can which i'll admit how i was in high school.

Overall all people in high school or people who recently graduated would probably really like this one.

2. Hataraku Maou-sama!

Reasons: This is one that you can enjoy mostly for the hilarity of it. Here is a summary of the series.

Devil King Sadao is only one step away from conquering the world when he is beaten by Hero Emilia and forced to drift to the other world: modern-day Tokyo. As "conquering the world" are the only skills the Devil King possesses�and are obviously unnecessary in his new situation�he must work as a freeter to pay for his living expenses!

This is probably the funniest show i've watched this season. Watching the characters adapt to the modern world in this show is quite hilarious. Sure this concept isn't anything new but it is done VERY well in this show. There is a bit of the original story (demons vs humans) that pops up every now and then that adds a bit of drama to air and there is a good amount of character development as well. So even if the comedy isn't your thing it's got a decent story going for it.

3. Attack on Titan

Reasons: Yep i'm sure you've heard of this one a million times over. Sure the series is a bit over-hyped but i'd say that it actually deserves the hype MUCH more than Sword Art Online did. This show will pull at your heart strings and you won't be able to tell what happens next most of the time. Personally i LOVE "End of the World" based anime because it's a good chance for artists to depict the trauma and despair humanity goes through in what could be their final hours. I won't spoil much but this anime has LOTS of deaths. There isn't a bunch of that "Friendship beats all!" crap that most shounen anime has. Humans are pretty much defenseless even with their current weapons against the titans and in a way it seems as though they are only slowly halting their demise.

The animation is also probably the best this season has to offer as well. The movements of characters and the titans are very smooth and fluid making every action scene a thrill to watch. The character models have very thick outlines which threw me off a bit but you hardly notice it after a while. I also respect this show for not having ANY fanservice at all. The women in this show are pretty influential and make most of the males look silly. (let's just say the MC gets embarrassed in training) It's always nice to see an anime depict women as strong influential characters and not just a piece of eye candy.

I agree this show may not be everyone's cup of tea but it's worth watching in my opinion.

4. Suisei no Gargantia

Reasons: Theres a bunch of mech related anime this season but this one stands out the most to me. Very great animation and character models. This is a bit like Hataraku Maou-sama where the MC has to adjust to a new world he has been sent too. Being a solider who was trained to do nothing but fight he is forced to learn how people in a primitive civilization live (he isn't even able to communicate properly without his robot for a while). He must also learn when it is necessary to fight and when to just leave things alone. There are many cases where he gets everyone in trouble because of his rashness to fight. Also not going to spoil anything but lets just say there is a big plot twist involving the MC's enemy in his original world. Very deep and compelling anime.

5. Ginga Kikoutai Majestic Prince

Reasons: Another mech anime. I must say it's pretty bland when it starts. But the story has picked up in recent episodes and become very interesting. There is plenty of action which is where mech anime shines. The characters are very troupey but still it's very amusing how they grow as a team. This one is a bit hit or miss. Chances are if you've already seen a lot of mech anime you won't like it. It's managed to keep my interests so far so i intend to follow it while it's still good. Also the soundtrack is very good as well.

These are in my opinion so i don't mind if people disagree with me. I would have elaborated a bit more but i don't wish to spoil the story for anyone who hasn't watched these yet.

I agree with all those, cept Attack on Titan.
It just gives me a bad 'Blood-C' vibe.
I keep waiting for it to turn to shit like The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya did with the 'Endless 8'.


I'd also suggest:
Date A Live: It's kind of silly, but it also gets kind of hard at times.
Not something I'd ever buy, but it's a cute/fun series that I could see myself rewatching within a year or two.


DEVIL SURVIVOR 2 THE ANIMATION: One of the best games on the 3/DS, and a damn fine anime in its own right.
Like the Person 4 anime...if you've beaten the game, there's really nothing 'new' for you here, but it's still a damn fun ride.


Photokano: This is a weird one.
It starts out with a 'o, look, ANOTHER fucking harem anime in HS+pertness'...but that all changed a few episodes in.
Now each one seems to be focusing on a 'okay, what if the MC stayed with THIS character, what would happen'.
It's a nice change of pace, and the whole 'camera focus' is actually an interesting plot device.



Valvrave the Liberator: Because HS students declaring themselves an independent nation after 'Zeon' attacks is nothing new...
But, the fights are pretty nice and I like the whole "Gundams turn you into a Vampire' angle.
ALSO: There's almost a 'power rangers' feel to it.



Hentai Ouji to Warawanai Neko: Surprisingly enjoyable SoL with decent comedy/gags.
It has its moments of reservedness, but not NEAR the level of shit series like 'sword steals boobes' (or w/e that series was called).

Mecha Anime are not what they used to be....
though I am a bit curious about Gothicmade. I love Mamoru Nagano mecha designs.
Brain Powerd was so gorgeous in the mecha design.

Mecha anime is like any other genera...they kind of go in and out when it comes to quality.


Gundam Seed was crap.
Gundam Unicorn was/is glorious.


Vision of Escaflowne was a amazing.
Eva 1.11/2.22/etc went from 'ooo' to 'o, look, more crap'.


Turn-A Gundam is fantastic.
G-Gundam is still horribad.

sorry orie but if you dont like a certain type of genre in anime, and you find i downright disgusting, its ok to voice your opinion, just dont start attacking people that DO like that particular genre.


and yes, people that say "but its legal in japan", are half wrong. pedophilia is not legal in japan, however, drawn images depicting minors in sexual acts are not considered actual children (like in the rest of the world, except the USA because they are fucktards).
on the other half, do remember that anime is made by japanase, FOR japanese. if theres an anime that features big boobed lolis, then its because japanese love big boobed lolis. they give exactly zero fucks what you, me, or anyone not from japan think about their anime.

@LeatherHead333 & Tanis. Thanks for the recomendations, pretty interesting and really appreciated!


Strike Witches...is lolicon?
O_O

Wow...didn't realize that.

Was that sarcasm?

I have never watched the stuff, fail to see the fascination.

Was that sarcasm?
Nope.

When I think of 'lolicon' I think most in hentai or 'almost hentai' series.


Strike Witches, I thought, was kind of funny/fun with the whole weirdness of it all.

Witch Hunter Robin is the only anime you'll ever need.
It really sums up life, the universe and everything all in 26 episodes.
It's not a bukkake-fest either. It's not a perversion of the entire society that spawned anime.

It's a giant metaphor for growing up in a fucked up world.

There was supposed to be a live-action series but that didn't pan out.
Thankfully, I don't see how a live-action can possibly capture all the magic.

A new series would be nice. After all, they only covered STN-J. There's other branches, you know.

The closest a live-action came in similarities was Paul McGuigan's Push (2009) (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0465580/).
Underrated and fun film. It could have used a much stronger structure and foundation.
It could have used Witch Hunter as a solid premise and really capture the audience.
That and would have warranted a trilogy.

Witch Hunter Robin is a good show. Nice one.

AmvHell is always something fun and pointless.
Although you can stretch it and say it's an accurate satire of the whole genre and society it stems from.

The pop culture references used to dub the audio exhibits the geek culture that surrounds anime as much as comics here in the West.
With cultured anime, you can really get your geek on.

And then there's the shallow end of the pool filled with children and drooling, lonely adults.
No really. AmvHell has a number of x-rated and racey parodies going on.
They take shows that display the common "Pre-Gloved Freddy Krueger" material that exploits and sexualizes children.
Mostly older males (teens to adults) with younger females (girls to... well, girls).

AmvHell Zero? or the one after 3. (hint: it's not named 4) is the most violent, bloody, gory, sexual, x-rated, perverted version of the series.
They'll show the really bloody messy side of anime (think Kill Bill's The Blood Splattered Bride that never got the non-black/white release).
They show the gory side (I think it was largely pre-Gantz material at the time of its debut).
And the dirty side (with non-children; albeit still young teens and such -- but teens on teens not men on teens).
And then the kiddie side.
it's a huge mix of everything and I think it generally seems to convey the overall message of anime as a culture and society, the state that is in.

For a good, gory, sci-fi go with Gantz. It has manga. And a movie (live-action). It has everything.
I think even tits (adults).

Berserk is another gory, bloody, adult manga/anime.

Though, it IS all levels of fucked up, and I kind of like it because it touches on as many taboo topics as it can.

Also:
The art is freaking AMAZING.

Witch Hunter Robin is the only anime you'll ever need.
It really sums up life, the universe and everything all in 26 episodes.
It's not a bukkake-fest either. It's not a perversion of the entire society that spawned anime.

It's a giant metaphor for growing up in a fucked up world.

There was supposed to be a live-action series but that didn't pan out.
Thankfully, I don't see how a live-action can possibly capture all the magic.

A new series would be nice. After all, they only covered STN-J. There's other branches, you know.

The closest a live-action came in similarities was Paul McGuigan's Push (2009) (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0465580/).
Underrated and fun film. It could have used a much stronger structure and foundation.
It could have used Witch Hunter as a solid premise and really capture the audience.
That and would have warranted a trilogy.

I agree Sparky fully - it was an awesome show which for once depicted the use of magic in a contemporary setting in a serious, police procedural manner. It almost didn't seem like anime but more like a US crime/thriller show with magic elements. Even how magic power is used is nothing overblown or over the top - subtle, but still sinister and destructive when used for evil ends, a refreshing change of pace from all that anime that tries to outdo each other with world-destroying powers contained within whiny teens.

I remember hearing rumours years ago that the US SciFi Channel was apparently interested in commissioning a US live-action adaption of the series, but unfortunately that never eventuated. Ah well, there's still the original anime which is good enough. :)

:ashine: I want a Blu-ray remaster of the series so badly... ; ;

Around ten years ago also, were Last Exile, Kino's Journey, Fantastic Children, Wolf's Rain. I thought they were pretty cool.

Around ten years ago also, were Last Exile, Kino's Journey, Fantastic Children, Wolf's Rain. I thought they were pretty cool.

Damn...has it really been THAT long since Wolf's Rain?


Now I feel old...
>>

Last Exile was good. I didn't get to finish all of it but was liking it.

Also: Patlabor.

The ending is top notch. I won't spoil it for you.

You can't go wrong with Patlabor.

I didn't mind Robotech so much, but I found Macross Plus, the four episodes, and the movie - which is slightly different(!) - to be my fave.

Onto more violent series, I particularly enjoyed Gungrave and Texhnolyze. And both Hellsing shows.

Pro-Tip:
If Yoko Kanno helped do the music, it's gonna be worth the time.

;)

i loved patlabor when it was transmitted here.
my favorite saga was when they were fighting the german labor.

ive always wanted to see last exile after watching the first episode, but no way in hell im gonna watch it subbed when i can get it dubbed (in latin american spanish of course).unfortunately, all the sites that have the series for downloading never updated it (some even still have MEGAUPLOAD downloads)

I thought the English dubbing was excellent. A.D VISION cast some talented voice actors over the years. It's a shame they went belly-up.

I agree Sparky fully - it was an awesome show which for once depicted the use of magic in a contemporary setting in a serious, police procedural manner. It almost didn't seem like anime but more like a US crime/thriller show with magic elements. Even how magic power is used is nothing overblown or over the top - subtle, but still sinister and destructive when used for evil ends, a refreshing change of pace from all that anime that tries to outdo each other with world-destroying powers contained within whiny teens.

I remember hearing rumours years ago that the US SciFi Channel was apparently interested in commissioning a US live-action adaption of the series, but unfortunately that never eventuated. Ah well, there's still the original anime which is good enough. :)

About those rumours, I'd say fortunately rather than unfortunately. This is a big subject of discussion. Huge in fact. Or at least it should be. I take your point that it feels like it could be a show with live-actors (as opposed to dead ones). But for me live action (re)makes are usually disappointing. For starters, casting is a major issue. Personally, I favour anime over live-action for many reasons, but that's as far as I'm willing to expound for now, as it's hurting my head to think about it.

Indeed, especially where SyFy is concerned. They may draw in their own crowd but it's not the strongest focal point when thinking TV sci-fi.
I would rather see AMC or HBO take on the live-action mantle if it ever happens.

Sure, CG has come a long way for "magic" and the like. But there's not a whole lot of audience for live-action "magic".
My dad likes "Once Upon A Time". But he's the only one I think.
BBC's Merlin series got quite a bit of popularity.

But it would really take a lot away from the original concept of Witch Hunter Robin and be totally bastardized to meet Western audiences.
Although a lot of the show isn't primarily based on Eastern religion or views, it still wouldn't be enough to convince any Western studio to make something so elegant without throwing their fecal matter into the project.

Knowing the West, they'd probably make the witch some sort of miserable goth (ala The Girl With The Dragon Tattoo) and make a totally obscure and farfetched background story. Filled with Da Vinci cults and probably go as far back as the writing of the Bible.
And sings a long to loud rock and roll in a tight elevator just to appeal to the suicidal goths of today's teen society.
And also sluts around and completely neglects the reason and logic in sex education because that's America and that's what teen American's want to see so they can justify their own destructive, teen-pregnant selves.

Oh, but the real lessons of the show won't happen until the season finale when they plan to cancel the show but it will get cancelled before then and look like a major bastard project of social depravity, spiritual perversion, magickal recklessness, and deface all the Wiccans/Pagans out there who practice innocently with symbols of Satanism because they can't hire Tom Hanks to be apart of it to educate our poor Christian/Heathen country on the significance of the symbols.

*jazz hands*

That's also the sad state of anime.
America needs only to distribute. Untouched, unscathed and unedited.
I think America misunderstands their own concept of a "free country". :notgood:

Well done for keying all that in. I'd just like to add, as I don't believe it's been mentioned so far, that 26 episodes is usually sufficient for a series, unless there is a massive pile of good ideas, in which case the series can be extended for another year or more. Once Upon a Time is a prime example of stretching out a show at the expense of ruining it. I know actors and film crews need jobs and all that, and I will shut up now.

:laugh: It's quite funny really.
But you're right about the series declining after awhile.
Sure shows like Cheers and The Simpsons and M.A.S.H. had a really good run (save Simpsons still running), but you can't expect the fans to love every episode and they eventually start to list off parts where the show lost its panache and had to spend half the season trying to do damage control.
I find a lot of the greater shows to be well made in less than three seasons.
Dead Like Me, FireFly, Life On Mars, Twin Peaks, Invader Zim, Witch Hunter Robin, Undergrads, Veronica Mars, Joan of Arcadia.
Any more seasons and they'd risk running out of great ideas and stuffing "filler" into each season just to make there great ideas really that great.
Like the whole illusion of pairing an "ugly" person beside an "average" person. :notgood:

I love the 26 episodes. I was dredding the end as I got near it but after it was finished, I was extremely satisfied with the series overall.
Continuing Robin's story would take away all the real magic behind the show.

But starting anew with someone else on a different continent would definitely be a nice way to continue.
With Hunter Steve~ If you follow.
Give the new hunter a 26 ep run.

Like how they're doing American Horror Story. Each season is an independent universe. Same actors, different roles with no connection whatsoever.

Maybe comics would be nice.
Not Buffy comic style either. Like physical comics.
Not Manga because I can't read right-to-left. I can never tell if it's going row by row or column by column. That and any English translation seems to just use White-Out on the Japanese characters and scribble in some junk.

About those rumours, I'd say fortunately rather than unfortunately. This is a big subject of discussion. Huge in fact. Or at least it should be. I take your point that it feels like it could be a show with live-actors (as opposed to dead ones). But for me live action (re)makes are usually disappointing. For starters, casting is a major issue. Personally, I favour anime over live-action for many reasons, but that's as far as I'm willing to expound for now, as it's hurting my head to think about it.

As far as live action remakes of anime go, I hear Beck is pretty good. Downloading it now from the great reviews I've heard of it. And I guess live action can work for comedy series, but otherwise it's indeed a good idea to steer clear of any remakes.


Well done for keying all that in. I'd just like to add, as I don't believe it's been mentioned so far, that 26 episodes is usually sufficient for a series, unless there is a massive pile of good ideas, in which case the series can be extended for another year or more. Once Upon a Time is a prime example of stretching out a show at the expense of ruining it. I know actors and film crews need jobs and all that, and I will shut up now.

Some series do more than 26 episodes pretty well. If you like shounen, certain series are pretty good, though mostly it is the older series that were great. Newer series tend to have few gems among a lot of crap. If you've ever heard of these, they are pretty good longer series:

- Yoroiden Samurai Troopers (Ronin Warriors in english)
- Yuu Yuu Hakusho
- Dragon Ball (every series except the filler seasons and GT)
- D.Gray-Man (anime is finished but manga is ongoing)
- Soukyuu no Fafner (has a TV series, prequel OAV, sequel movie, and there's an upcoming TV series that will be a sequel to the movie)

As for series that are 26 episodes or shorter that you might not have heard of that are also excellent:
- .hack//SIGN
- Night Head Genesis
- Noein

And there might be some debate on that, but Code Geass was pretty excellent imo with its two 25-episode seasons. It does have the tendency to degenerate into excessive fanservice at times, but otherwise has an excellent plot.

It's a shame that some series end too soon.

Escaflowne was rushed, towards the end, and could have used a few more episodes to flush it out.

The art is freaking AMAZING.

The artworks of Berzerk are indeed amazing. although...from a guy with a BA in history, it's not as "gory" as you think. Of course, there weren't real demons roaming the world in the middle ages, but battle were gorefests, due to weapons that relied more on cinetic impact than real cutting power (two handed blades, for examples, or axes too) and all the many weapons dedicated to crush, maim or break into tiny bits your ennemy: Morningstars, war hammers, flails, etc, etc.

Punishments and trials were another gorefest altogether: Some trials relied on "god's judgement", also called the "trial by ordeal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_by_ordeal)". as for punishments...well...killing someone was done in style:

first, they broke the guys bone using a breaking wheel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breaking_wheel). If the offense was enough to go further, the body was then dismembered, before the head was cut. sometimes, the body parts were spread around the country, for example if the culprit was a rebel leader. oh, and for good measures, the bodies were often eviscerated and the organs burnt in public.

Finally, don't forget torture was in use. actually, confessions were only receivable AFTER torture had been used.

---------- Post added at 11:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:04 PM ----------


It's a shame that some series end too soon.

Escaflowne was rushed, towards the end, and could have used a few more episodes to flush it out.

Indeed, but in some cases, a few episodes could have been cut. a good example is Fushigi no Umi no Nadia (or Nadia, the secret of blue water), of which a good 5 or 6 eps (around episode 30) are completely useles on top of being really badly directed, drawn and animated.

As far as live action remakes of anime go, I hear Beck is pretty good. Downloading it now from the great reviews I've heard of it. And I guess live action can work for comedy series, but otherwise it's indeed a good idea to steer clear of any remakes.



Some series do more than 26 episodes pretty well. If you like shounen, certain series are pretty good, though mostly it is the older series that were great. Newer series tend to have few gems among a lot of crap. If you've ever heard of these, they are pretty good longer series:

- Yoroiden Samurai Troopers (Ronin Warriors in english)
- Yuu Yuu Hakusho
- Dragon Ball (every series except the filler seasons and GT)
- D.Gray-Man (anime is finished but manga is ongoing)
- Soukyuu no Fafner (has a TV series, prequel OAV, sequel movie, and there's an upcoming TV series that will be a sequel to the movie)

As for series that are 26 episodes or shorter that you might not have heard of that are also excellent:
- .hack//SIGN
- Night Head Genesis
- Noein

And there might be some debate on that, but Code Geass was pretty excellent imo with its two 25-episode seasons. It does have the tendency to degenerate into excessive fanservice at times, but otherwise has an excellent plot.


I liked Yu Yu Hakusho. Top of my list of favourite long running shows are

- Hokuto No Ken / Fist of the North Star (152 episodes)
- Gatchaman (105 eps) & Battle of the Planets (85 eps)
- Ghost in the Shell SAC 1 & 2 (2 x 26 episodes)

Funnily enough Fist of the North Star the live action movie was also one of the worst films ever made.

I personally found Noein to be a bit too kids' Saturday matinee-ish. However, the episode near the end of the series with the car crash was incredibly dramatic, and it's a shame the rest of the series didn't match up to that standard.

I liked Yu Yu Hakusho. Top of my list of favourite long running shows are

- Hokuto No Ken / Fist of the North Star (152 episodes)
- Gatchaman (105 eps) & Battle of the Planets (85 eps)
- Ghost in the Shell SAC 1 & 2 (2 x 26 episodes)

Funnily enough Fist of the North Star the live action movie was also one of the worst films ever made.

My number 1, and it will always remain so, is Yoroiden Samurai Troopers. It's not just nostalgia, it's the fact that I can rewatch it any number of times and still
love it. Both the TV series and the OAVs are pretty great. As an added bonus, as an anime-only series, there's no filler or other crap.


I personally found Noein to be a bit too kids' Saturday matinee-ish. However, the episode near the end of the series with the car crash was incredibly dramatic, and it's a shame the rest of the series didn't match up to that standard.

I have only seen the english dub of Noein, but honestly, if the art is a bit cartoonish, the plot is anything but. If you ask me it rivals any other science fiction story in terms of originality. At times it even creeped me out quite a bit with how sort of dark its story is. And since we're on the subject of anime and I've recently been kinda obsessed with the FF7 game Crisis Core, I'd like to say that even if Last Order isn't considered canon, I still loved it.

Has anyone seen Wolf Children - and was it any good?

I have never watched Anime, seems to be more of a European fixation.

I have never watched Anime, seems to be more of a European fixation.
Que?

That's...a weird view I've never heard.

I have never watched Anime, seems to be more of a European fixation.

That statement makes absolutely no sense. Anime is popular everywhere nowadays.

Not at all never had an interest in it.

---------- Post added at 10:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:29 PM ----------


That statement makes absolutely no sense. Anime is popular everywhere nowadays.

Look at you mate..Post #12 in almost 4 years.

Anime on the West Coast Of America and over the age of 30 doesn't register with even the faintest "blip" on the screen.

because the west coast of the US covers the entire american continent......

Do you know Ethics?
Anime nowadays just throw that to the trash.
It's like (referring to lolicon), yeah Pedo is legal in japan, but not in other countries. So you accept pedo stuff anyway, just because it is legal in japan? If you think like that, what does that make you? That makes you and hidden Pedo on society. I don't care how some people may be hit with this, but it is true.

I'd like to point out that even though it doesn't relate to ethics, dubbing companies also take liberties with anime, such as paranoidly changing the shape of some objects just so no religious extremists get offended by some kind of perceived symbolism. Personally these kinds of changes really offend me.


Another difference between Old Anime Veterans and New Anime fans: We didn't saw or think like that. We loved anime , Yes, but not the OBSESSED way the New anime fans are. Don't tell me otherwise, because they are the ones all itchy to make a cosplay of something. It's a matter of taste? Yes. I personally don't find it appealing and I see it as a loss of time. I admit, some cosplay are very well done. But what does that contribute? For futility issues. Because Japan is the Nation of Futility, and their good technology is wasted in futility. But hey, it works. Brainless people go buy anything they shit out of their ass.

There's really nothing wrong with cosplay. Anime is a hobby, and there are varying levels of commitment to any hobby. For instance, baking is one of mine, but I don't bake that often and I tend to stick to easy sweets rather than complicated cakes. Cosplaying is no more wrong than dressing up for Halloween. There's no age limit for either one, and it's all about how much you enjoy it. You can say that you don't enjoy it, but you can't say it's a bad thing just because you don't personally enjoy it. Of course cosplay doesn't serve any specific purpose, neither does children's playing. It's made just for fun, and it's not wrong to do things just for fun every once in a while.


Another though I got now.
Back then, old veterans did not had internet. Between friends, people would save money together to order from another country too see an anime VHS.
Nowadays it is internet, and (not saying everyone does that, but in my country seems to be the daily life of a new supposed anime fan) they see (eat) TERABITES of anime 24/7. But I still like the fact that these New Anime fans have no culture about anime at all. The culture they have and BAD is about the new anime... But go ask them who Is Yoshiaki Kawajiri.
And yes, everytime an anime fan comes to me in my country I humiliate him without mercy. Because they came to me like they know all about there is to be know about anime. The arrogance of these characters is of such extreme level that I really feel the need to be a Serial Killer.
I mostly compare new anime fans Arroganc to those supposed Flac audiophiles lovers (I had my share with A LOT of ARROGANT son's of bitches. Luckily some people are more open minded then those, they love flac, but they dont judge as a stupid living thing for not liking flac).

And no. I am not Close Minded in the anime nowadays. I am very Open Minded. But I am also very stuck in beliefs, and Lolicon is just as Disgusting as watching boobs scenes endlessly in the anime. Sorry. I am not that pervert to like something that rapes my beliefs.

A few things I'd like to say here. First of all, my first and favorite anime was, just like you, bought from someone who made me VHS copies of both the dub and the original version (there were no subs at the time). I got both the TV series and OAVs raw, cauz no dub existed for the OAVs at the time anyway. Even though we had our first computer with internet around then, and that's how I bought the VHS tapes, I did come to chat with several people and even join a ML this way.

Secondly, most people really aren't like that. The kind of person you're describing is known as an otaku in Japan, and the kinds of people who don't leave their homes anymore are known as hikikomori. You can Google it if you want more details about it. However, most people really do balance anime with their normal lives. I don't think it's right to define most anime fans as being a certain way just because some of them behave that certain way.

Thirdly, I don't think it's arrogance so much as it is excitement as well as the fact that you can only talk about what you know. If you only know newer series, you can't talk about older ones unless you go out of your way to look for and watch them. Rather than humiliate people for what they don't know, I'd like to show them that older series are great. I agree about FLAC (and APE) btw: to me it's a stupid format that takes up way too much space on a computer, you can't even tell the difference between it and MP3 at 320kbps. MP3 is more convenient with its smaller file size, and more easily accessible outside of torrents too.

Fourthly, I completely agree about lolicon, pedophilia and big-breasted girls: I'm just not interested in those types of series at all. In my experience, the focus tends to be only on those things and there's no intelligent plot to go with it. So yes, I do hate those types of series, but if others want to watch something like that, that's their business. I'm not going to judge so much as I'm going to avoid those series. And if someone who likes those types of series also likes other types that I'm actually into, I'll take them to them about those instead, otherwise I'll just avoid those people altogether. Really, it's easier to ignore things than it is to actively hate on them.


Gundam Seed was crap.
Gundam Unicorn was/is glorious.


Vision of Escaflowne was a amazing.
Eva 1.11/2.22/etc went from 'ooo' to 'o, look, more crap'.


Turn-A Gundam is fantastic.
G-Gundam is still horribad.

Before you make statements like these, keep in mind that there are people who like the series you hate, and hate the series you like. No one likes to hear people trashing the series they like. Also, you say Gundam Unicorn is "glorious", but for the most part that is because of its animation quality. Each episode was worked on for months on end, and that's a luxury that few (if any) series get. I like Gundam Seed, and no one is going to shame me into disliking it. If you want to say that Destiny was a mess though, I will totally agree with you. :)

But if there's one thing you can't criticize about Dragon Ball Kai it's its animation. The new music may be less interesting than the older stuff, but the animation is absolutely great.


Look at you mate..Post #12 in almost 4 years.

Anime on the West Coast Of America and over the age of 30 doesn't register with even the faintest "blip" on the screen.

Wow, look at you, trying and failing to make a comeback. I would say nice try, but I'd be lying.

And man, ignorance sure likes to talk. Older series are pretty much the classics that everyone's heard the names of at least once. Series like Sailor Moon, Dragon Ball, Gundam series. All of those are known. By comparison, newer series are popular for a moment but if they're not memorable, which most aren't, they are quickly forgotten. Not to mention pretty much all of your Saturday morning cartoons are either dubbed older anime series or American series heavily based on anime concepts.

Anime has gotten more sophisticated and darker since the 90s. More psychological and controversial themes are common, themes which play with the overall genre (like Madoka). I prefer the sci fi animes with cyborgs like Ghost in the Shell, Real Drive, and Texhnolyze.

Once upon a time, anime used to be made by human beings... now it's made by computers. There is no substitute for artistry, and for that uniquely beautiful look that comes when something is assembled by hand. I miss the flawed but visually gorgeous anime of yesteryear - but that said, my favourite era was probably the late seventies, early eighties. That's exclusively from the visual perspective. Story wise, I think there's still some good stuff out there... but what with the Japanese economic downturn they're taking fewer risks these days; why take a chance and throw some money at something that might be a work of genius - and may fail miserably... when you can make a formula show on the cheap you know will do moderately well - enough to pay your salary and keep your studio afloat for another six months?

I have great hopes that the industry will recover and that new blood will emerge. The jury's still out on Yamakan - personally, I think he's got a lot to offer but whether he ever does is another matter.

We shall see, I suppose.

As far as anime's popularity and social acceptability... by and large, it doesn't exist in the UK. If anime has any mainstream recognition it's through Pokemon - maybe Bleach or Naruto. If you tell anybody you're into anime you'll likely get a) ignored, b) accused of being a pedophile, or c) a glimmer of recognition - "Isn't that Chinese cartoons like that big Owl dude with the umbrella, Tomomo, wasn't it? My Best Mate Tomomo? Yeah, I know those Korean shows. They're cool,, I guess" followed by being ignored.

Once in a blue moon you'll get something more than that... but let's just say I live a very lonely life as an anime fan in the real world in this country.

In Japan, it seems to be as it always was.

I totally agree that the look of animation is distinctly CG nowadays and I think the merits and demerits of this trend has to be judged on a case-by-case basis. Personally, I feel that Gundam has benefitted much from CGI but everyone will have different opinions I am sure.

Has anyone been watching the new series that's come out this past week?

I've been debating on following a few of them.

I totally agree that the look of animation is distinctly CG nowadays and I think the merits and demerits of this trend has to be judged on a case-by-case basis. Personally, I feel that Gundam has benefitted much from CGI but everyone will have different opinions I am sure.

Yup, it's all CG, but the worst part is, it's not even nice CG. It's deformed faces with huge eyes and in my opinion, it's frankly ugly for the most part. A lot of animes exaggerate and those that don't are few and far between.


Has anyone been watching the new series that's come out this past week?

I've been debating on following a few of them.

Which new series specifically are you referring to?

Which new series specifically are you referring to?
IDK, the ones that just aired this past week or two:
I have these bookmarked as 'maybe':

anime maybe
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9663
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9854
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9808
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9107
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9555
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9857
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9509
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9465
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9798
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9620
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9736
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9365
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9676
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9482
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9782
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=8929
http://animecalendar.net/show/754/Makai_%C5%8Cji%3A_Devils_and_Realist
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9582
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9395
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9606
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9751

There's really nothing wrong with cosplay. Anime is a hobby, and there are varying levels of commitment to any hobby. For instance, baking is one of mine, but I don't bake that often and I tend to stick to easy sweets rather than complicated cakes. Cosplaying is no more wrong than dressing up for Halloween. There's no age limit for either one, and it's all about how much you enjoy it. You can say that you don't enjoy it, but you can't say it's a bad thing just because you don't personally enjoy it. Of course cosplay doesn't serve any specific purpose, neither does children's playing. It's made just for fun, and it's not wrong to do things just for fun every once in a while.


I did a cosplay once, as Hanson fron Nadia. 'twas glorious. I was also part of an attempt to make a giant Saint Seiya cosplay around 2001, with ALL the anime series characters. it didn't happen. I don't have a problem with Cosplay, probably because I also do LARP.



Secondly, most people really aren't like that. The kind of person you're describing is known as an otaku in Japan, and the kinds of people who don't leave their homes anymore are known as hikikomori. You can Google it if you want more details about it. However, most people really do balance anime with their normal lives. I don't think it's right to define most anime fans as being a certain way just because some of them behave that certain way.

Thirdly, I don't think it's arrogance so much as it is excitement as well as the fact that you can only talk about what you know. If you only know newer series, you can't talk about older ones unless you go out of your way to look for and watch them. Rather than humiliate people for what they don't know, I'd like to show them that older series are great. I agree about FLAC (and APE) btw: to me it's a stupid format that takes up way too much space on a computer, you can't even tell the difference between it and MP3 at 320kbps. MP3 is more convenient with its smaller file size, and more easily accessible outside of torrents too.

I beg to differ. it is arrogance. I've met the kind of folks Orie speaks about. I've also met some of the same kind in other hobbies, like miniature wargaming or roleplaying games. Some like to think that because they've seen a few recent gainax products, they know all there is to know on the studio. or they harass you in cons about this and this and this. and making complete fool of themselves.

One of them once told me there was a chinese novel that had been inspired by the Hades chapter...:notgood:

NO. just NO. I had to patiently explain him that Kurumada, just like so many other authors, had taken ideas from "Water Margin" for the specters. and all those kids considering Naruto is the alpha and omega of shonen just piss me off to no end. they don't even realize that, in France, they owe the presence of this amazingly stupid series to...a 1977 mecha series (Ufo Robot Grendizer). no. animes are popular because naruto is soooo coooool !!

So yes. it IS arrogance. talking about what you know is a thing. but admitting you don't know everything is another matter. of course, for each of these idiots, there's at least two young peeps who started through Naruto or something even more recent and who will develop an interest for something much older. I know a 14 years old who's hooked on anime designed by Yoshikazu Yasuhiko.

Also, Hi Orie !! :D

---------- Post added at 02:28 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:20 AM ----------


IDK, the ones that just aired this past week or two:
I have these bookmarked as 'maybe':

anime maybe
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9663
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9854
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9808
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9107
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9555
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9857
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9509
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9465
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9798
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9620
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9736
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9365
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9676
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9482
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9782
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=8929
http://animecalendar.net/show/754/Makai_%C5%8Cji%3A_Devils_and_Realist
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9582
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9395
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9606
http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=9751

I'd give a chance to the following: either the chara design is interesting (Gifuu Doudou!! Kanetsugu to Keiji) or the general description is more "curious" than the others (Servant x Service, Uchouten Kazoku, Genshiken Nidaime). the rest...

NOPE !

I'm thinking the problem is the audience nowadays settle for shit, makers then produce shit to please those audiences and then ad nauseam.

Has anyone been watching the new series that's come out this past week?

I've been debating on following a few of them. I'm currently trying to finish watching everything. I'll give you a list when i'm done.

I might have sound like that old man that complains about anything and yet doesn't do zip. Allow me to elaborate:

If there's something young ones lack today is respect. Not that we were the nicest, mind you, but we've come full circle: strict parents led to a generation of balanced parents who in turn led a generation of relaxed parents that led to the current generation of kids like Bieber and such. Of course this is all generalizations, not everyone is like that, but helps point out the problem.

They don't respect good music, they don't respect their teachers. Anything that was created before they were born has no significance. Naruto is good to them, despite Dragon Ball Z and others doing it before. But they don't respect that, even with proof before their eyes, because is "old", because if there's anything relevant it has to be what was created for them, in their generation. It doesn't matter if it's shit. They adore Saint Seiya Omega and despise Saint Seiya, who cares if the new one is shit! "It's ours" they say "Created for us. Your old anime doesn't deserve our respect". So they settle for whatever crap they can get. And producers/mass marketeers see that they don't need to push the boundaries, that they can throw anything out there and sell it.

You find it unbelievable? Look around. I might be wrong. But I'm not dead wrong.

Did someone say "Justin Bieber"? Bieber vs. Desert Eagle - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXfMI7xVPj4)

The culprit behind the total lack of discernment is all the conditioning that goes on perpetrated by media and film production bosses who constantly churn out brainwashing/mind-control material (crap to you and me). The food supply is another area of attack. We need to save the future of mankind, and we can start by telling them what some of our 'pillars of the community' are doing to them, and pray they snap out of it.

I beg to differ. it is arrogance. I've met the kind of folks Orie speaks about. I've also met some of the same kind in other hobbies, like miniature wargaming or roleplaying games. Some like to think that because they've seen a few recent gainax products, they know all there is to know on the studio. or they harass you in cons about this and this and this. and making complete fool of themselves.

One of them once told me there was a chinese novel that had been inspired by the Hades chapter...:notgood:

NO. just NO. I had to patiently explain him that Kurumada, just like so many other authors, had taken ideas from "Water Margin" for the specters. and all those kids considering Naruto is the alpha and omega of shonen just piss me off to no end. they don't even realize that, in France, they owe the presence of this amazingly stupid series to...a 1977 mecha series (Ufo Robot Grendizer). no. animes are popular because naruto is soooo coooool !!

I don't know why I didn't get an email notification of a reply to this, but anyway... What you describe exists in a minority and definitely does not define the majority. Your novel example proves my point about ignorance rather than arrogance: that novel author may well have been inspired by the Hades chapter of Saint Seiya and really not have known anything about the myths behind it. Even if they weren't, that's ignorance on the fan's part. Arrogance, btw, is found more in gamers than in anime fans in my experience, and it also tends to apply more to the clubs than to regular fans.


So yes. it IS arrogance. talking about what you know is a thing. but admitting you don't know everything is another matter. of course, for each of these idiots, there's at least two young peeps who started through Naruto or something even more recent and who will develop an interest for something much older. I know a 14 years old who's hooked on anime designed by Yoshikazu Yasuhiko.

Reread your example carefully. That's a clear case of ignorance. Arrogance is a whole other animal.

They don't respect good music, they don't respect their teachers. Anything that was created before they were born has no significance. Naruto is good to them, despite Dragon Ball Z and others doing it before. But they don't respect that, even with proof before their eyes, because is "old", because if there's anything relevant it has to be what was created for them, in their generation. It doesn't matter if it's shit. They adore Saint Seiya Omega and despise Saint Seiya, who cares if the new one is shit! "It's ours" they say "Created for us. Your old anime doesn't deserve our respect". So they settle for whatever crap they can get. And producers/mass marketeers see that they don't need to push the boundaries, that they can throw anything out there and sell it.

You find it unbelievable? Look around. I might be wrong. But I'm not dead wrong.

I realize this is a pretty old post to respond to at this point, but I somewhat agree and somewhat disagree with you. I guess it also depends on if we are talking about anime in Japan or outside of Japan. As far as outside of Japan goes, it's true that there's, generally speaking, reluctance by younger viewers to watch older shows. There are some really great shows that I can't ever talk to my friends about, because they are either too young, or weren't into anime at the time when those shows were originally released (in America). Techniques and art styles are different now, which means some of the older animation just doesn't look good enough to them so they won't watch it. This annoys me greatly because it's some great stuff they are missing. On the other hand, I grew up with that stuff, so it's something I'm used to. If I go back and watch an older show now, I still like them because I enjoyed the story and everything, but I could see how the changes the industry has made with digital animation and the like might make it harder for me to really get into older shows if I was just starting out now. But is that really any different than how it goes with other art? There are many really great movies that were made a long time ago in black and white or when color was first starting out. I'm pretty much never going to watch those. It's not because I don't respect them, I just have no interest in dealing with black and white or just the tone of some of the older stuff. Likewise with music. Sure, I like a bunch of older songs, but not nearly as much of it as my parents do, who grew up with it. I like a greater amount of songs from when I've been around.

If we are talking about anime in Japan, that's a different story. Most of what's made these days, and pretty much anything not original in origin, is made to promote sales of other stuff. If it's shit it doesn't really matter so long as sales increase on the other stuff. What is generally hoped for, is that the otaku, which are the people that will religiously go out and collect everything they can that relates to a show, manga, game, whatever that they like, will buy all this stuff. So a bunch of shows are made that would appeal to what the otaku like, so that they buy. Not just the show on DVD/Blu-Ray, but all the related material. So that's why a bunch of crap gets made these days. The reason for that is, generally speaking, most of the 'good' stuff just doesn't sell well enough. There is plenty of good stuff being made all the time, but it very rarely becomes a huge hit.